The Evans sisters - baptisms?

[ElizabethHerts]

I'm returning to the puzzle of OH's 5x-great-grandmother and her sisters.

Despite having the paperwork from a huge Chancery case I don't know their parents' names. I'm wondering whether, after the passage of a few years, it will now be easier to find their baptisms.

OH's 5x-great-grandmother was Susanna Evans before her marriage.
http://www.genealogistsforum.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=15645&highlight=Susanna+Evans
She married William Lamb by Licence at All Hallows, Tottenham in 1751.

There are:
Ann Evans
She married William Bassett in 1776 by Licence.
http://search.findmypast.co.uk/record?id=gbprs%2fwsmtn%2f5109384%2f00336&parentid=gbprs%2fm%2f492122103%2f1&highlights=%22%22

http://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bin/sse.dll?_phsrc=lES443&_phstart=successSource&usePUBJs=true&indiv=1&db=SurreyMarriage&gss=angs-d&new=1&rank=1&gsfn=William&gsfn_x=0&gsln=Bassett&gsln_x=0&MSAV=1&uidh=ho3&pcat=34&fh=3&h=84668&recoff=4%205&ml_rpos=4

This is her will:
http://interactive.ancestry.co.uk/5111/40611_310054-00573?pid=527134&backurl=http://search.ancestry.co.uk//cgi-bin/sse.dll?_phsrc%3DlES429%26_phstart%3DsuccessSource %26usePUBJs%3Dtrue%26indiv%3D1%26db%3DCanturburyPr erogativeCourt%26gss%3Dangs-d%26new%3D1%26rank%3D1%26msT%3D1%26gsfn%3DAnn%26gs fn_x%3D0%26gsln%3DBassett%26gsln_x%3D0%26MSAV%3D1% 26uidh%3Dho3%26pcat%3D36%26fh%3D2%26h%3D527134%26r ecoff%3D7%25208%26ml_rpos%3D3&treeid=&personid=&hintid=&usePUB=true&_phsrc=lES429&_phstart=successSource&usePUBJs=true

The Chancery case involves her property in Glamorgan.


Jemima Evans
She married John Kent in 1752 at St George's, Bloomsbury, London.

http://search.findmypast.co.uk/record?id=gbprs%2fwsmtn%2f005620183%2f00421&parentid=gbprs%2fm%2f492256883%2f2

She must have been born c. 1730.

Mary Evans
She married Richard Hobbs in 1747 at St George's Chapel, Mayfair, London.
http://search.findmypast.co.uk/record?id=gbprs%2fm%2f492249908%2f1


Susanna, Mary and Jemima all seem contemporary. As Ann Evans/Bassett didn't marry until 1776 and her husband William Bassett was very hopeful of having children with her (which didn't happen), I'm wondering whether she was the daughter of a second marriage of Mr Evans. In any case, she inherited property in Glamorgan, Wales, which was the subject of the Chancery case.

Very frustratingly, the Chancery case has not shed any light on how Ann Evans came to possess the property, nor has it mentioned her parentage.

If I could find the girls' christenings it would solve my problem!

[kiterunner]

One of the witnesses at Ann Evan's marriage to William Bassett was James Gwyn, and her will mentions that he was one of the "parties of the third part" in her marriage settlement. The PCC will of James Gwyn of Neath, proved in 1785, mentions his wife Esther and his brother-in-law Thomas Evans late of Aberlash in the County of Carmarthen Esq deceased.

So he must be the James Gwyn who married Hester Evans 23 Mar 1771 at St Martin in the Fields.

There is a Jemima Evan, daughter of Griffin Evan, baptised 11 Feb 1728 at Maenordeifi, Pembrokeshire, Wales, but it may take a while to see whether there are likely baptisms for the rest of the sisters with father Griffin. Just off to search...

[ElizabethHerts]

Wow, Kate, many thanks for that.

Off for the day - will return to this asap.

[kiterunner]

Not getting anywhere with baptisms for the others.

[ElizabethHerts]

Thanks for looking, Kate. I'll have a good look tomorrow and see what I can find on James Gwyn. Have just got in.

[kiterunner]

Is it possible to guess at the names of the sisters' parents from the names of their (the sisters') children, Elizabeth?

[ElizabethHerts]

Here are the names of the sisters' children:

William Lamb and Susanna Evans
Richard Richman (Richman was William's mother's maiden name; no Richard on the Lamb side)
William Evans (must have died)
Hannah
William Evans

John Kent and Jemima Evans
Ann
Susanna
Jemima
Sarah
Thomas
William

Richard Hobbs and Mary Evans
Mary
Hannah

I had thought perhaps Susanna was a significant name in the Evans family.
Thomas is very common, but perhaps that too.

[kiterunner]

I wonder whether Susanna's father was called William Evans, given that two of her sons had that name, or is it William after their own father and Evans after Susanna? The Jemima, daughter of Griffin, could easily be a red herring.

I'm still getting nowhere. I didn't mention before that James Gwyn's will (written 1784, proved 1785) actually says "Rice Evans surgeon, youngest son of my brother in law Thomas Evans late of Aberlash in the County of Carmarthen Esq deceased". So maybe we can find a record of Rice Evans and trace his Evans line back and see if we can find a connection with the sisters. I did have a quick look for Rice Evans the other day with no luck but will try harder this time!

[kiterunner]

Well, here's something:

UK Register of Duties Paid for Apprentices' Indentures (ancestry)
19 Aug 1776 Wm Prothero of Llandilo, Carmarthen, Surgeon & Apothecary, apprentice Rice Evans.

[kiterunner]

FMP has the burial of Thomas Evans Esqr of Aberlash, buried 6 May 1780 at Llandybie, Carmarthenshire. And a Mr Rice Evans was buried at Llandybie 13 May 1790, age 35. I've been looking at the wills on the National Library of Wales website but not managed to find anything connecting them with the sisters yet. I did find some online information about Aberlash but nothing that seems to help:
http://www.terrynorm.ic24.net/historichouses.htm

[ElizabethHerts]

This is such a complex case, Kate.

The following mentions the property in dispute:

<NAS XL 1/4/1> Breconshire: multiple parishes
<NAS XL 1/4/1> Lease and release in consideration of £1,600 dated 9 and 10 Aug 1791, between i) William Lamb of Huntingdon Town, Huntingdonshire, gardener, and his wife Susannah; also John Kent of White Horse Court, St. Olave's parish, Borough of Southwark, Surrey, cordwainer and his wife Jemima (Susannah and Jemima both the surviving sisters and heirs of Ann Bassett formerly Evans dec'd); ii) William Bassett of Neath town, Glamorgan, esq. and Rev. Thomas Bassett of Lanelay, Glamorgan, clerk; Messuages, farms and lands called Tir kenol yn Bromvidd and Tir maur yn Bromwidd; also messuages and farms called Tir Nant Lleche or Tir Nant Hir, Y Gorse Wen, Bryn y keel, Aberllia, all in Ystradvelltey [Ystradfellte] parish, Breconshire. Also messuages and farms called Gwain or Wern y Gilvach, Llwyn Llafrod, Tir y Garth, Tir verch vorgan and Tir Llwyn Turnor, Tir y Dyffnant and Maes y Vron in Ystradgunlais [Ystradgynlais] parish, Breconshire
[3 parchments; 10 seals]

[Nell]

Good luck, Elizabeth! I know from the Chancery case in my husband's family how frustrating it is to have lists of family members without any idea which is related to whom or how!

[kiterunner]

Did you ever find out more about this couple, Elizabeth?

http://www.genealogistsforum.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=9570
http://www.genealogistsforum.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=9857&highlight=powell

[ElizabethHerts]

Kate, I'm sitting her surround by documents relating to this case - probably at least 50 sheets of A3, and many thousands of words between them.

I'm trying to refresh my memory about this. I'll look at the Powells again.

Other names of some importance.

Herbert Mackworth - probably Sir Herbert Mackworth

The Turbevilles


Some of the writing in the Chancery case is barely legible so I'm trying to go back over the documents that were difficult to decipher.

[kiterunner]

A couple named William and Rachel Evans had the following children baptised at All Saints, Edmonton, Middlesex (in the LMA records on ancestry):
Thomas 1 or 9 May 1722
Joseph 9 Feb 1724 - poss burial 28 Apr 1729
Richard 5 Dec 1725
Sarah 9 Aug 1727 - poss burial 29 Nov 1730
Susanna 19 May 1729 - buried 24 Aug 1730
Susanna 14 Mar 1731
Jemima 25 Mar 1732/3
Anne 7 Oct 1734

The Edmonton PR's don't give any extra info such as father's occupation.

[ElizabethHerts]

Thanks, Kate. That's very interesting and promising.

Some time ago I downloaded the PCC will of a William Evans of Edmonton, but his wife was Barbara and his daughters Elizabeth and Mary Ann. It was proved in 1784.

I know there was at least one brother as this is mentioned somewhere.

[ElizabethHerts]

A couple named William and Rachel Evans had the following children baptised at All Saints, Edmonton, Middlesex (in the LMA records on ancestry):
Thomas 1 or 9 May 1722
Joseph 9 Feb 1724 - poss burial 28 Apr 1729
Richard 5 Dec 1725
Sarah 9 Aug 1727 - poss burial 29 Nov 1730
Susanna 19 May 1729 - buried 24 Aug 1730
Susanna 14 Mar 1731
Jemima 25 Mar 1732/3
Anne 7 Oct 1734

The Edmonton PR's don't give any extra info such as father's occupation.

Susanna's date fits in well with William Lamb's wife.

[ElizabethHerts]

Look what I have found:

http://pstatic.powys.gov.uk/fileadmin/Docs/archives/records_catalogue/Deposited_misc/B_D_WWA_bi.pdf


B/D/WWA/2/144
Deed (copy) to make a tenant to the precipe
1. John Bullock Lloyd of Brecon, esq.: Thomas Bullock Lloyd, only son
and heir by Sarah, his late wife (late Sarah Lloyd of Brecon, devisee and
sole executrix of Thomas Lloyd of Brecon dec’d)
2. Hugh Bold of Brecon, gent.
3. Robert Saint John Lucas of Bath, co.Somerset, innholder
Of m., tmt. and lands called Llanbrynhyan, ps. Llanvrenach [Llanfrynach]
and Llanvigan [Llanfeugan], in tenure of William Williams; m., tmt., farm
and lands called Berthllwyd, p.Llanvigan, (David Thomas); m., etc. Tyr
Bine otherwise Tyr Rheedy Bine, p.Llanvigan; m., etc. called Tyr y
Noyadd, p.Llangattock near Crickhowell (James Morgan); cap.m. or
mansion house where Sarah Lloyd formerly dwelt with garden, 3 stables,
apps., in town of Brecon’; m. or dw. house adjoining of samuel Vally
brazier; barn and piece of pasture, p. St. Davids, Brecon, formerly of Sarah
Lloyd; m., etc. called Tyr y Noyath and Cae Crwm, p.Llandevalley
[Llandyfalle] (Evan Price); m., etc. in Eskir vawr [Ysgyr-fawr], p.Merthir
Kynog [Merthyr Cynog] (William Williams); m., etc. called Tyr y Van
Oley, p.Merthir Kynog (Jonathan David); m., etc. of Tyr y Karennydd,
p.Llanvihangel Nantbrane (Howell Price); m., etc. Tyr Penterwy otherwise
Tyr David Howell Walter, p.Llanthetty [Llanddeti] (William David) ; m.,
etc. of Tyr Gwern Taglwst, p.Llangunider (Richard Giles); m., etc. in Cwm
Crawnon, p.Llangunider (Howell prees); m., etc. Tyr Pedole, p.Llanvigan
(Thomas John); Tyr y Wayne, ps.Lanvrenach and Llanvigan (Richard
John); Masterglwdd Ycha (Thomas Price); Masterglwdd Ysha (John
Jenkins) ; the Wenallt (Philip Pritchard); Penyrallt and Cae Coch (Thomas
Price); all in p.Llanigon; ms., etc. Tilleglase and peny Coed, ps. Glasebury
and Llanelieu (John Llewelin); 2 ms., etc. Llwyne filley and the Cockett, ps.
Glasebury and Llanigon (Richard Wood); m., etc. Tyr Kelsey otherwise
Kelly Vawre, p.Llanvihangel Abergwesin (formerly David Lloyd); Tyr yr
Caire (formerly Thomas Lloyd now William Williams); ms., etc called Tyr
y Pant, Tyr Castellan, Tyr y Kae newidd, and Tyr y Kae Llwydd (formerly
William Lloyd); ms. etc. Tyr Bringwissin (formerly John Williams), Tyr
gwar yr Coed otherwise Tyr yr Cadvod Bach (formerly Thomas William
John), Tyr y brin mole (formerly William Thomas David); ms. etc. called
Llwyne Gwillim, Brynarch and Troed Rhue Goch (formerly purchased of
Thomas Evans); ms., etc. Panteague and Cae Llwyde (Thomas Jones) - all
in p.Langamarch; m., etc. Tyr Cwmdulon (formerly William Thomas [and?]
David Bevan); ms., etc. Tyr Llawes Ely and Tyr brin betting (formerly Rees
Meredith and Evan Thomas); Tyr Pen yr Rhewgoch and Tyr Llwyne y
Croyse (formerly William Thomas) - all in p.Llanlleonvel; one third of 5
ms., or dwhouses. in town of Brecon (Barbara Stringer,widow; Thomas
Llewelin; George Awbrey, William Evans; Thomas Powell; Ann Prichard,
widow; George Awbrey; Thomas Powell [repeated in error?] Charles
Prichard, gent); closes, etc. called Cae Llykey, little Close by the old Gaol,
Cae Plwck hallog House and garden, Cae Garow, maes y Vallen and Close y
dellin, spot of land near a barn in possn. of Miss Jane Meredith, p.St. John
the Evangelist, Brecon (John Wilkins, esq., George Morgan, gent., William
Gilbert, Samuel Hughes, esq., James Lewis, carpenter, Benjamin Thomas,
coachmaker); 1/8th of ms. or burgage houses, etc. in Brecon, suburbs and
p.St. John the Evangelist (Bartholomew Cook, Lettice Griffiths, Sarah
Lloyd, John Young); 1/8th of ms., farms etc. called Tille Coch, Gwern fraith,
Llech y Clawdd, Keloyd Jevan Ycha, Tyr y Waine otherwise Tyr Verch
meyrick, Maes y Llan and Llwyne Kirwch, ps. Bettus and
Llandevodwg [Llandyfodwg], co.Glam. (formerly Evan Leyson, Lewis Powell,
others,[B] which Thomas Lloyd purchased from heirs of William
Evans of Edmonton, co.M’sex, ropemaker, and wife Rachel); 2
ms., etc. Tyr Rhue Goch and Ynis Hire, ps. Devynock and Llanvihangel Nantbrane
(William Lewis, Lewis Lewis, John Evan).
For suffering a Common Recovery at Great Sessions, co.Brecon.
Declaration of uses.

I'm not sure what all this means yet. I'll have to read it in detail as I have just found it. Some familiar names in there.

[ElizabethHerts]

For the record:

PRECIPE

1. a written request, addressed to a court, for a writ to be produced, specifying what the contents of the writ should be
2. a writ instructing that a given action be taken, or demanding a reason for failure to take the given action

[kiterunner]

I know there was at least one brother as this is mentioned somewhere.

It was in Sarah Powell's will.

[ElizabethHerts]

We are missing a baptism for Mary Evans, who married Richard Hobbs in 1747.

[kiterunner]

We are missing a baptism for Mary Evans, who married Richard Hobbs in 1747.

Yes, I know. I was looking for her last night but no luck.

[ElizabethHerts]

At least we have William and Rachel Evans associated with Wales.

I wish I knew Rachel's maiden name.

[kiterunner]

Well, I did see this marriage on FamilySearch last night but was dubious because it is so far from Edmonton, but now you have found the Welsh connection, maybe it is the right one?

31 Dec 1721 Cynwyl Gaeo, Carmarthenshire, William Evan married Rachel Thomas. I think I looked at it on FMP last night and there was no extra info.

[ElizabethHerts]

Well, I did see this marriage on FamilySearch last night but was dubious because it is so far from Edmonton, but now you have found the Welsh connection, maybe it is the right one?

31 Dec 1721 Cynwyl Gaeo, Carmarthenshire, William Evan married Rachel Thomas. I think I looked at it on FMP last night and there was no extra info.

I saw that, Kate. I wish there was more information, though. It was the only one that came up on FMP.

[ElizabethHerts]

Burials at All Saints, Edmonton:

Name: Joseph Evans
Burial Date: 28 Apr 1729
Parish: All Saints, Edmonton
County: Middlesex
Borough: Enfield
Record Type: Burial
Register Type: Parish Register

Name: Sarah Evans
Burial Date: 29 Nov 1730
Parish: All Saints, Edmonton
County: Middlesex
Borough: Enfield
Record Type: Burial
Register Type: Parish Register

Name: Susanna Evans
Burial Date: 24 Aug 1730
Parish: All Saints, Edmonton
County: Middlesex
Borough: Enfield
Record Type: Burial
Register Type: Parish Register

Name: Rachel Evans
Burial Date: 28 Dec 1747
Parish: All Saints, Edmonton
County: Middlesex
Borough: Enfield
Record Type: Burial
Register Type: Parish Register

Name: William Evans
Burial Date: 9 Dec 1747
Parish: All Saints, Edmonton
County: Middlesex
Borough: Enfield
Record Type: Burial
Register Type: Parish Register

Name: William Evans
Burial Date: Feb 1748
Parish: All Saints, Edmonton
County: Middlesex
Borough: Enfield
Record Type: Burial
Register Type: Parish Register

[ElizabethHerts]

The crucial will of Sarah Powell:

In the Name of God Amen
I Sarah Powell of the Town of Neath in the County of Glamorgan Widow being of a sound and disposing mind and memory and understanding Do hereby make and publish this my last Will and Testament of and concerning All my Worldly Estate in manner and form following (that is to say) I give devise and bequeath unto my Maid Servant Anne Jeffreys in case she shall be in my Service at the time of my death one Annuity or Yearly Rent charge of ten pounds for and during her life to be issuing and payable out of all that my ffrehold tenement and Lands called Kelvidd Evan Yrlia situate in the Parish of Bettws in the said County and now in the tenure and occupation of Evan Layson or his undertenants or assigns the same to be paid at two half yearly payments (that is to say) on the ffeast days of St. Michael the Archangel and the Annunciation of the blessed Virgin Mary the first payment thereof to begin and be made of such of the days as shall next happen after my decease with full power for the said Anne Jeffreys and her Assigns to enter upon the said premises and make distresses for the same in case of non payment thereof and subject to the said Annuity I give and devise the same Land and Premises unto my Neice Anne Evans and to her Heirs and Assigns for ever Also I give and devise all those my Freehold Messuages Tenements and Lands situate in the several Parishes of Ysradginlaise and Ysteadweltay in the County of Brecon and also all those my Freehold Messuages Tenements and Lands situtate in the Town of Neath and in the several Parishes of Neath Bettws Glyn corrwg and Llanddew? in the said County of Glamorgan and all other my Real Estate wheresoever situate in the said Counties of Brecon and Glamorgan unto my said Neice Anne Evans and to her Heirs and Assigns for ever Subject nevertheless to the payment of my just Debts ffuneral Expenses and the Legacies herein after by me bequeathed Also I give and bequeath unto the brother and such of the sisters of my said Neice Anne Evans as shall be living at the time of my decease the sum of three hundred pounds to be paid them share and share alike by the said Anne Evans within two years next after my decease In case they shall not trouble or molest her in the execution of this my will But if they trouble or molest her therein in or any ways dispute the validity thereof then the said Legacy to become void Also I give and bequeath unto Thomas the son of Hopkin Watkin of the Town of Neath Butcher the sum of five pounds towards putting him an Apprentice to be paid by my Executrix herein after named when he arrives at a proper age to be settled as such Also I give and bequeath the sum of two pounds towards putting up an altar piece in the Chancel of Neath Church to be paid by my Executrix when the same shall be put up Also I give and bequeath one years wages unto each of my Servants who shall live with me at the time of my death to be paid them by my Executrix over and above what shall be then due to each of them for wages Also I order and direct to give unto Mrs Susannah Gwynn of the Town of Neath Mr Thomas Eason of the City of Bristol and to each of his children a Mourning Ring a peice Also I order and direct my Executrix to bury me in a decent manner at her discretion in the Chancel of Neath Church with my late Husband All the rest and residue of my real and personal Estate of what kind soever they be I give devise and bequeath unto my said Neice Anne Evans And I do hereby nominate and appoint her sole Executrix of this my will hereby revoking all former Will and Wills by me heretofore made and do declare this to be my last Will and Testament In Witness whereof I have hereunto set my Hand and Seal the twenty second day of November in the year of our Lord one thousand seven hundred and sixty six - Sarah Powell - signed sealed Published and declared by the above named Sarah Powell as and for her last will and Testament in the presence of us who have hereunto subscribed our Names as Witnesses thereto in her Presence and in the Presence of each other
W. Jones Jno Bradford Mansel Williams


This Will was proved at London the twelfth day of February in the year of our Lord one thousand seven hundred and seventy six before the Worshipful Do? Sk?eet Doctor of Laws Surrogate of the Right Worshipful Sir George Hay Knight also Doctor of Laws Master Keeper or Commissary of the Prerogative Court of Canterbury lawfully constituted by the Oath of Anne Evans Spinster the Neice of the deceased, and sole Executrix named in the said Will to whom Administration was granted of all and singular the Goods Chattels and Credits of the said deceased having been first sworn duly to administer


Marginal note:
On the 7th day of July 1791, Admon (with the Will annexed) of the Goods Chattles and Credits of Sarah Powell late of the Town of Neath in the Co of Glamorgan Widow left unadd by Anne Bassett formerly Evans Wife of William Bassett Esqr the Niece of the said decd sole Extrix and Residuary Legatee named in the said Will since also decd was granted to the sd William Bassett the lawful Husband and Admon with the Will annexed of the Goods of the sd Anne Bassett decd having been first sworn duly to administer

[ElizabethHerts]

Evan Layson is mentioned in the other reference to William Evans of Edmonton, ropemaker, and his wife Rachel.


Can I be fairly sure I have found the sisters' family now?

[kiterunner]

I think so.

[ElizabethHerts]

I think so.

That's a relief! Still a long way to go.

Thanks for getting me on a bit further, Kate.

[ElizabethHerts]

Reference: PROB 11/945/255
Description: Will of Thomas Evans, Ropemaker of Great Coggeshall , Essex
Date: 27 January 1769
Held by: The National Archives, Kew
Legal status: Public Record
Closure status: Open Document, Open Description


I can't find this on Ancestry at present.

[ElizabethHerts]

Found it in the end.

http://interactive.ancestry.co.uk/5111/40611_310492-00240/632921?backurl=http%3a%2f%2fsearch.ancestry.co.uk% 2fcgi-bin%2fsse.dll%3fdb%3dCanturburyPrerogativeCourt%26 gss%3dsfs28_ms_r_db%26new%3d1%26rank%3d1%26gsln%3d Crull%26gsln_x%3d0%26msddy%3d1769%26gskw%3d%2509%2 6MSAV%3d1%26uidh%3dho3&ssrc=&backlabel=ReturnSearchResults#?imageId=40611_31049 2-00273

Thomas Evans was from Daventry and seems to have nothing to do with the Evans family I'm researching.