View Full Version : More marriages to find.
I'm looking for:
1) A man surname Watkinson (possibly, but not necessarily Thomas) marrying female Lavender (if he is Thomas she is probably Ann). Miss Lavender was probably born in Bedfordshire or Hertfordshire and was probably dead by 1808.
They definitely had a son Samuel Robert Watkinson who I think is on the 1841 census aged 51 living in Ridge Herts b in Herts. He died later in 1841. They also had a dau Ann Watkinson who was alive and unmarried in 1808.
2) Levi Lavender (brother of the bride above) marrying Leah Maynard. Leah was b in Herts in the mid 1770s. Her husband was probably significantly older, perhaps b abt 1760. All their children were b in Herts, the first in 1794.
3) James Lavender (sibling of Levi and Ann) b abt 1764 married Ann X abt 1800. They had several children - some bap at St Giles Cripplegate in London, some of those were born in other places though inc Ridge Herts and Barking Essex. The eldest known child was b 1801 and bap St Giles Cripplegate and was buried at Bunhill Fields the same year. The Next child was born at Barking, Essex and survived. I don't have a baptism for the second child.
Having finally managed to open a non-conformist birth record on ancestry for Samuel Robert Watkinson 1789, it is the right entry (b Herts) and his parents are Thomas Watkinson and Ann (should be nee Lavender)
kiterunner
17-05-14, 10:49
Boyd's Marriage Index (FMP) has Thomas Watkinson marrying Ann Lavender 1788 at Christ Church Newgate (aka Christ Church Greyfriars).
Thankyou Kate. I did look on fmp, so will try and find it myself to see what I was doing wrong.
I've just added a third sibling to the list!
kiterunner
17-05-14, 10:56
I don't think ancestry has the image.
Boyd's Marriage Index (FMP) has Thomas Watkinson marrying Ann Lavender 1788 at Christ Church Newgate (aka Christ Church Greyfriars).
I found that easily, so I can only imagine I didn't find it during the spell I was thinking Thomas's surname was Wilkinson rather than Watkinson, but never went back for a second look! :o:o:o
Thanks again!
Hmmm.....there's a burial for Anne Watkinson 8th April 1794 at Ridge Herts, but she is 40 making her birth about 1754. So, she was relatively old when she married (for the time period).
I still haven't found a baptism for her daughter, Ann.
Ah, never trust the transcription! Anne was 33 not 40 and also 'of North Mims'.
There's a PCC will and Baptist burial for Thomas Watkinson (sensible age to be Ann's husband) in 1826 in St Albans. He was married to a Frances by that time and she seems to have remarried to Daniel Woodhouse in 1832.
I have to go and fetch dau now, but as I've not read the will right through yet, I need to confirm when Thomas married Frances he was a widower and the dates fit.
kiterunner
17-05-14, 11:27
FMP has a marriage transcription for Thomas Watkinson widr of Parson Drove marrying Frances Corston wid otp 25 Jan 1796 at Tydd St Giles, Cambs.
She must have been a young widow, as I've seen Frances with her third? husband in St Albans aged 60 in 1841 and 83 in 1861.
Mary from Italy
17-05-14, 12:55
Sorry to complicate things, but Frances Watkinson, w. of Thomas, was buried at Tydd St Giles in 1806:
http://www.cfhs.org.uk/resultsd.cfm?dbase=Burial&surname=&forename=&gsearch=&forindex=90203&tag=4
Mary from Italy
17-05-14, 12:57
And a Thomas Watkinson aged 68 was buried at Tydd St Giles in 1835:
http://www.cfhs.org.uk/resultsd.cfm?dbase=Burial&surname=&forename=&gsearch=&forindex=90220&tag=4
Frances seems to have been born Witham Essex abt 1778, so maybe the Cambs marriage may be a red herring?
Mary from Italy
17-05-14, 12:59
Looks like it, yes.
Sorry, Mary, I made my last post before seeing your two!
Perhaps the widow Frances Watkinson who married Mr Woodhouse wasn't the widow of Thomas Watkinson?
I should probably read Thomas Watkinson's will more thoroughly, as probably exactly who his second wife was is not too important whilst being sure it's the correct Thomas W is!! lol
I've just read the 1826 will properly and mentioned are: wife, Frances, son Samuel Watkinson (no middle name) grandson, Samuel Watkinson and daughter Ann the wife of John Syddon. he also says his two children (Sam sr and Ann) have been well provided for by their great uncle Mr Samuel Dungley (at least, that's how I read his name!)
So, it looks like the right will, esp if I can show that the son, Samuel Robert Watkinson did have a son called Samuel and that Ann Syddon was born in the right place, if she survived to be on the census.
OMG - that must be Ann Liddon/Lyddon (not Syddon)
Because I've found this marriage:
John Wm Liddon bachelor of Hemel Hempstead to Ann Widowson Watkinson otp at St Botolph Bishopsgate in 1813.
Mary Widowson Phillips was this Ann's first cousin and Mary's two silblings, Evan and Ann Phillips are witnesses at the above marriage.
Ann W and John W Liddon are on the 1851 census at Berkhampstead. They are both 59 and she is b North Mimms, Herts.
Isn't that one of those places right on the county boundary?
Mary from Italy
17-05-14, 13:53
Samuel probably did have a son Samuel, because he's listed in the death duty index on FMP in 1841 as Samuel R Watkinson of Ridge, and the executor's Samuel Watkinson of Grove, Kentish Town.
Excellent - thanks Mary.
Going shopping now.
Am I correct in my assumption that if I think either of the two missing marriages might have taken place in Essex (I wondered if the James Lavender to Ann one might have done), then I may as well forget about it??
Oh, is this where I would pay for a lookup?
http://www.sturnidae.com/Essex/Marriages.htm
kiterunner
17-05-14, 21:53
Am I correct in my assumption that if I think either of the two missing marriages might have taken place in Essex (I wondered if the James Lavender to Ann one might have done), then I may as well forget about it??
FamilySearch are indexing the Essex PR's but not complete yet. If you had an idea which parish(es) then you could buy a sub to SEAX / Essex Ancestors to look at the images.
Thanks Kate - I'll have a look round to see what else I can find and then perhaps do that.
There seems to be a connection to Barking for James Lavender who married Ann about 1800.
Several of their children who lived long enough to appear on the 1851 census were born there, despite being baptised in London. I'm wondering if Ann came from that area.
These are the children I have for James and Ann:
James b 1801 at ?, bap 1801 St Giles Cripplegate, bur 1801 at Bunhill Fields
James b 1802 Barking, bap ?, died 1882 Holborn district
Levi Benjamin b 1806 at ?, bap 1806 St Giles Cripplegate, bur 1824 Ridge, Herts
Elizabeth b 1808 Barking, bap ?, died 1878 Holborn district
George b 1811 at ?, bap 1811 Ridge, Herts, bur 1830 Ridge
John b 1814 at ? bap 1814 St Giles Cripplegate, bur 1843 Bunhill Fields (bap says residence Hertfordshire)
Thomas Matthew b 1817 (prob Ridge) Herts, bap 1817 Ridge, d 1870 Hackney district
Looking at FS Barking records there is this burial:
Name: Lewis Lavender
Event Type: Burial
Event Date: 29 Jun 1804
Event Place: Barking, Essex, England
Gender: Male
Age: 0
Marital Status:
Birth Year (Estimated): 1804
which I bet should say Levi and is probably for a child b between their second son, James and Levi Benjamin.
There's also a bap for Elizabeth:
Name: Elizabeth Lavender
Event Type: Christening
Event Date: 13 Jan 1809
Event Place: Barking, Essex, England
Gender: Female
Father's Name: James Lavender
Mother's Name: Anne
I hadn't recorded a birthplace for Ann, James' widow who died in 1846. I think that's because she said Yes for b in County in 1841 when living in St Luke's Finsbury, but it says Yes for her dau, Elizabeth too and she was b in Essex and also Yes for Elizabeth's brother, Thomas Matthew who was born in Herts!
Oooh, James Lavender's father wrote a long will which I've had for ages. I don't think I had taken in before that he describes James as 'of Barking Essex' (in 1808)
Possibly more interestingly, James' father leaves bequests to various people who I didn't have on my tree when I first had the will, but now do. He doesn't state their relationships to him, so I thought they were perhaps business acquaintances. I now see they were various relations of his wife.
The only one I had not identified was James Smith farmer of Kempston, Beds.
Now we have more indexes available I think I have positively identified this James as dying about 1828 as he has a PCC will proved that year:
James Smith farmer of Kempston. Leaves bequest to Lydia Lavender wife of John Lavender farmer of Biddingham, Beds (don't know who they are yet). Several bequests for people named Peacock and then relations:
Brothers, Thomas Smith, John Smith and (the very helpfully named) Lavender Smith!
So, more stuff to investigate.
I don't know how old James was as I think his burial may be one at the Bunyan Meeting in Bedford in 1828 with no age recorded. I think I am pinning my hopes on finding out more entirely on his having a brother named Lavender!
Drat, Lavender buried later the same year is also ageless, but he has a will, so off to read that......
Pretty much the same people in his will, but he gives relationships for the Peacocks and Lydia Lavender, so that's better.
Have to go and do other things now.........:(
Brother Thomas Smiths will in 1830 and there's another brother still alive called John.
kiterunner
18-05-14, 09:17
Ancestry has the marriage of a James Lavender and Ann Goode 5 Jan 1801 at Holborn St Giles in the Fields, by Licence, but I have only found the entry in the Bishop's Transcripts so far so no further info:
Bishop's Transcripts (http://interactive.ancestry.co.uk/1623/31547_213095-00034/10023617?backurl=http%3a%2f%2fsearch.ancestry.co.u k%2fcgi-bin%2fsse.dll%3frank%3d1%26new%3d1%26MSAV%3d1%26ms T%3d1%26gss%3dangs-g%26gsfn%3djames%26gsfn_x%3dXO%26gsln%3dlavender%2 6gsln_x%3dXO%26msgdy%3d1792%26cpxt%3d0%26catBucket %3dr%26uidh%3dvm5%26msgdp%3d10%26cp%3d11%26mssng0% 3dann%26pcat%3dROOT_CATEGORY%26h%3d10023617%26reco ff%3d11%2b12%2b33%26db%3dLMAmarriages%26indiv%3d1% 26ml_rpos%3d2&ssrc=&backlabel=ReturnRecord)
I will look some more.
kiterunner
18-05-14, 09:21
Here is the entry in Pallot's but doesn't give any more info:
Pallot's Marriage Index (http://interactive.ancestry.co.uk/5967/222_docu0004-04/930871?backurl=http%3a%2f%2fsearch.ancestry.co.uk% 2fcgi-bin%2fsse.dll%3fdb%3dpallotm%26so%3d2%26pcat%3dROO T_CATEGORY%26MS_AdvCB%3d1%26rank%3d1%26new%3d1%26M SAV%3d2%26msT%3d1%26gss%3dangs-g%26gsfn%3dja*s%26gsfn_x%3dXO%26gsln%3dlav*d*r%26g sln_x%3dXO%26msydy%3d1792%26msydy_x%3d1%26cpxt%3d0 %26catBucket%3dr%26uidh%3dvm5%26msydp%3d10%26cp%3d 11%26mssng0%3dann*%26mssng0_x%3d1&ssrc=&backlabel=ReturnSearchResults)
I don't know how I didn't find this marriage yesterday, unless I never got as far as your number 3!
I'd found that one (several times!), but couldn't do anything to prove it was right and only a few days before the bap of their first child (19th Jan St Giles Cripplegate).
kiterunner
18-05-14, 09:53
and only a few days before the bap of their first child
If it was my family tree I would almost take that as proof it was the same couple! :d
The final? Smith brother has a PCC will in 1834 - looks like he names lots of relations!
I'm only researching back and sideways with the Lavenders (or trying to) in the hope there are going to be further links between them and my direct line of Maynard.
It may turn out the link isn't that far back as I'm thinking it's possible Thomas Maynard (father of the Thomas whose will I got from Bedford CRO the other day) may have married one of the Lavenders and that is why he had children Levi and Leah which are names used by the Lavenders in the previous couple of generations but not by the Maynards as far as I know.
I'm just waiting for SOMEONE to name Thomas Maynard or another Maynard relative in their will!
I've gathered together a list of people from the various Smith wills, but am having trouble finding entries to tie then together and now I keep jumping from one to the other and getting my surnames muddled, so it's time to pour a glass of red. :o If in doubt these people were most likely all from Bedfordshire
John Lavender married Lydia Bar(r)inger
They are on the 1851 census- Lydia is 57 b Goldington Beds and John is 63 b Bletsoe.
I have John L's baptism but not Lydia's or their marriage.
Leah Smith (probably b Pavenham, Beds 1752) married Thomas (?) Baringer and they were the parents of Lydia Baringer (above). I thought I'd found this marriage on Ancestry, but I can't find it now :o
Lydia Smith married Samuel Peacock of Wilhamstead, Beds. I only know Lydia was Leah Smith's sister and was probably younger.
Ann Smith (another sister) married Edward Peacock of Oakley Beds
Leah, Lydia, Ann, Thomas (of Cardington), John (of Bedford), James (of Kempston) and Lavender Smith (of Cardington) were all siblings. I have found two baps in Pavenham Beds for Leah 1752 and Thomas 1756 but none of the others. The parents for those two are Joseph Smith and Lydia.
I'm thinking those parents are probably Joseph Smith and Lydia Lavender as I have a Lydia Lavender on my tree b 1726 and she has a sister called Leah who she might have named a daughter after - but I can't find a marriage to fit.
Ah-ha!
Name:Sam Peacock
Gender:Male
Marriage Date:19 Feb 1807
Marriage Place: Cardington,Bedford,England
Spouse: Lydia Smith
That's probably later than I was looking. I wonder if I have my generations is a muddle? :o
Ah-ha!!
Name:Edward Peacock
Gender:Male
Marriage Date:22 Apr 1802
Marriage Place:Saint Paul,Bedford,Bedford,England
Spouse: Ann Smith
I need to find Leah's burial to see if there's an age and if it fits with the (rather early?) baptism I found.
Name:Thomas Barringer
Gender:Male
Marriage Date:22 Jul 1788
Marriage Place:Saint Paul,Bedford,Bedford,England
Spouse: Leah Smith
kiterunner
18-05-14, 19:01
FMP has the burial of a Leah Barringer in 1814 at Goldington, Beds, age 62.
Here is the entry in Pallot's but doesn't give any more info:
Pallot's Marriage Index (http://interactive.ancestry.co.uk/5967/222_docu0004-04/930871?backurl=http%3a%2f%2fsearch.ancestry.co.uk% 2fcgi-bin%2fsse.dll%3fdb%3dpallotm%26so%3d2%26pcat%3dROO T_CATEGORY%26MS_AdvCB%3d1%26rank%3d1%26new%3d1%26M SAV%3d2%26msT%3d1%26gss%3dangs-g%26gsfn%3dja*s%26gsfn_x%3dXO%26gsln%3dlav*d*r%26g sln_x%3dXO%26msydy%3d1792%26msydy_x%3d1%26cpxt%3d0 %26catBucket%3dr%26uidh%3dvm5%26msydp%3d10%26cp%3d 11%26mssng0%3dann*%26mssng0_x%3d1&ssrc=&backlabel=ReturnSearchResults)
I don't know how I didn't find this marriage yesterday, unless I never got as far as your number 3!
I'd found that one (several times!), but couldn't do anything to prove it was right and only a few days before the bap of their first child (19th Jan St Giles Cripplegate).
If it was my family tree I would almost take that as proof it was the same couple! :d
Just moving the above posts to the end in case I can work out if Ann Goode is the right person.
Am currently bogged down adding the people in the Smith wills to my tree with no idea if they will every be connected to me, but this will save me going through it all again in the future!
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