Mary, later McCarthy, 1805 Kilkenny, Ireland - 1887 Holborn, London

[Nell]

Ex's mother's father's father's father's mother is unknown.

Ex's mother's father's father's father is Dennis/James McCarthy/Carter. I only know his father is Callaghan McCarthy from Dennis McCarthy's marriage cert. Dennis consistently says he is born 1829ish in Holborn. I can't find him with Callaghan or a likely Callaghan so have no idea about Dennis's mother!

[Merry]

I guess this is stuff you have already seen, Nell, so I've not spent ages with it!

Who is this?

Name: Callaghan McCarthy
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1801
Year of Registration: 1877
Quarter of Registration: Jan-Feb-Mar
Age at Death: 76
District: Holborn
County: London, Middlesex
Volume: 1b
Page: 506

I did find someone listed as "Callaching Mc Carthy" on Ancestry in 1871, who is likely this man who died in 1877. I tried to make him a waggoner, but he insists on being a greengrocer!

Only picked him out because of the area he lived in and because his age seemed reasonable. He and his wife have put their counties of birth o the census too :)

[Merry]

They have a married dau with them b in London, so they should be around on earlier records (it's all v difficult to read....)

[Merry]

I think this is the dau's marriage:

Marriages Mar 1860
Brighton William Lambeth 1d 369
Gook Mary Ann Lambeth 1d 369
McCarthy Mary Ann Lambeth 1d 369 <<<<<<<<<<<<
Stratton James Lambeth 1d 369 <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<


and her mum's death:

Deaths Jun 1887
McCarthy Mary 86 Holborn 1b 420

Found them in 1851 but not 1841:

http://search.ancestry.co.uk/iexec?htx=view&r=5538&dbid=8860&iid=MDXHO107_1515_1515-0315&fn=Mary+Ann&ln=Mc+Carty&st=d&ssrc=&pid=2741002

I really must get moving now!! lol (Just ate my porridge in bed!)

[maggie_4_7]

Found two 1841 census no idea if they're any good but not a common name one a Bricklayer and one a Shoemaker. First one has a Dennis with them wrong age though b 1839 but I suppose they could be connected!

http://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bin/sse.dll?indiv=1&rank=1&gsfn=cal*&gsln=mccarthy&sx=&f1=Middlesex&f2=hoborn&f3=&f18=&rg_81004011__date=1805&rs_81004011__date=0&_82004011=ireland&_82004013=&f7=&f20=&f8=&f9=&gskw=&prox=1&db=uki1841&ti=5538&ti.si=0&gss=angs-d&pcat=35&fh=1&h=7842639&recoff=8+9

this one is unlikely but its not a common name at that time in London...

http://search.ancestry.co.uk/iexec?htx=view&r=5538&dbid=8978&iid=MDXHO107_664_664-0026&fn=Callagan&ln=McCarthy&st=r&ssrc=&pid=7036351

[Merry]

I focussed on looking for Bridget aged 8 in 1841, but that didn't help! lol

[Merry]

I wonder if this is Mary Ann's birth? (there's another in 1839 though)

Births Dec 1840
McCarthy Mary Ann Holborn 2 140

[Nell]

I'll have a look later, Merry - thanks for looking and thanks too to Maggie.

The problem is that although I've found a few Callaghans and other McCarthys I can't tie them in with Dennis - I really need to find his baptism.

[Nell]

Hm, looked back at my notes and I did have some of the info already, but although I'd got the Holborn death I hadn't found a candidate earlier. The greengrocer has the right name, is the right age to be Dennis' father AND in 1871 is living in a very likely area...Of course it would be fab if it was the right chap as it does give a county of birth.

Something to look into further.

[Nell]

I've just had a laugh!

Found Callaghan who died 1877 in a personal family tree on Ancestry. I have found most trees are a mixture of records and guesswork but this takes the cake:

it has a timeline for Callaghan:

1803 Birth Cork, Ireland
1851 arrival in New York USA
1861 census in Camberwell, a hairdresser, unmarried
1871 census in Westminster [not him, but a chap called Timothy McCarthy]
1877 death
1880 Boston, Suffolk, Massachussetts, USA [again Timothy]
1881 West Ham, London [this time a Jeremiah McCarthy]
1891 Llantwit Fadre, Wales [John McCarthy]

and I thought my tree was a muddle!

[Merry]

lol Nell!

Cal McCarthy is in Saffron Hill in 1851 and Dennis says Saffron Terrace on his marriage cert in 1848.

[maggie_4_7]

Merry

Well done I think you have them in 1851!

It certainly does say Saffron Terrace, Saffron Hill.

http://search.ancestry.co.uk/iexec?htx=View&r=5538&dbid=1623&iid=31280_197409-00062&fn=Dennis&ln=Mccarthy&st=r&ssrc=&pid=3016962

[Nell]

One day Merry I shall set you onto the ex's Denisons!!!!

Seriously, I'm chuffed, and have filed all the extra info in the hope that I can tie them into Denis/James one day.

[Nell]

As for Callaghan being a wagoner on the wedding cert and a potato dealer or greengrocer in the censuses, I can only say that Elizabeth Goodwin (Denis' wife) says on the cert her dad is a waiter [a post with customs & excise, NOT a restaurant waiter] but he appears on all censuses as a carpenter.

[Merry]

lol How do you know she meant the customs sort!

I wonder where that family are in 1841? If Dennis is their son then that would be the place to prove it, but I've searched and searched and found zilch that fits properly.

[Merry]

Just for info...

The witnesses to the marriage of Julia Agnes McCarthy to Wm Howarth Pickering at St Mary, Haggerston in 1866 were George Wm Napper and Elizabeth Napper. (Julia's dad is Callaghan McCarthy, a greengrocer)

The witnesses to the marriage of John McCarthy to Emma Ann Watkins at St John, Lambeth in 1861 were George Wm Napper and Nancy Napper. (John's dad is Callaghan McCarthy, a carman)

[tenterfieldjulie]

Nell with the wagoner on the marriage cert, is it a typed transcript or a handwritten one?

[Merry]

It was handwritten by the vicar/curate on the marriage cert for Denis McCarthy and Elizabeth Alice Goodwin.

How about this though?!!

George William Napper married Elizabeth Bridget McCarthy in 1856, at St John Lambeth. Her dad is Callaghan McCarthy, a greengrocer. (I guess she is the Bridget I've been looking for in 1841, so I suppose she may have been listed as Elizabeth on that census :rolleyes:)

Anyway, the witnesses are..........*drum roll*

Den(n)is and Elizabeth Alice McCarthy

:D:D:D:D:D:D

[Nell]

Merry!!!


((((megahugs to you)))))

Wow! I am gobsmacked. That's the link I've wanted. I was so hoping this was my lot - and wondering if I was trying to make things fit but you've come up trumps. I can't tell you how thrilled I am and this shows the value of this take one gt grandparent idea!

I was similarly indebted to a GR member who first found the link between the Carters and the McCarthys. I really couldn't have done this without the efforts of others.

I am as pleased as a pig with two tails!

Much gratitude!

[Merry]

lol! *oink*

[maggie_4_7]

Well done Merry and Nell I love it.

:D

[tenterfieldjulie]

Brilliant girls - inspite of the pig with two tails and oinking. lol :eek:
You must be over the moon Nell. :D:D
Such an encouragement to everyone who has hit a brick wall...

[Asa]

Brilliant stuff Nell and Merry - been a long time coming :-)

[Nell]

Worth the wait, Asa!

[Phoenix]

Assuming Denis is called Denis in 1841, this is the only one that isn't with family: HO107 piece 728 folio 2/23 page 41