View Full Version : Need help finding Fred
Mary Ann MARSHALL aged 18 marries Francis Frederick Knight in Oct 1880
Father
Frederick Marshall a Box Maker
Baptism address St Johns Road
31 Jan 1864
Born 11 Jan 1864
Father Frederick Marshall a Fancy Box Maker
Mother Emma
Cannot find this Frederick anywhere?? or Mary Ann before her Marriage ?
or a Marriage between a Frederick Marshall and a Emma
1881
Have found a William Marshall Married born abt 1840 in Bolton Lancashire a Box maker in Scrubs Prison ???? Could this be him ??
1871
Emma Marshall Married born 1843 Shoreditch a Box Maker
Son Fred Marshall born 1861 Shoreditch
living with Emma's Parents
William Moore born 1813 a Tailor
Mary A Moore born 1807
So looking for a marriage between a Frederick Marshall and a Emma ??
or any census records where they are together
or
Mary Ann anywhere before her Marriage
PPLLEEAASSEE
Do you know Francis Frederick Knight's occ and age at marriage? What were his father's details?
or Mary Ann before her Marriage ?
Oh, so you have her afterwards then? Where was she born?
Is that St John's Road Islington? The area is teeming with people doing that sort of trade. (fancy box maker)
On the 1861 census there's Frederick Marshall a box maker from York in Shoreditch, but his wife is Emily not Emma.
This looks like Fred in 1861: RG09 piece 239 folio 18 page 38 in Shoreditch with wife Emily.
Thanks Phoenix and Merry
Francis was a Cabinet Maker
she was born in Shoreditch
St Johns Road Hoxton
and thanks for that 1861 census will take a look
Surely this is the marriage:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Marriages Sep 1859 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Herbert Mary Ann Hackney 1b 521
Macpherson Harriet Pancras 1b 521
Marshall Frederick Hackney 1b 521 <<<
Moore Emily Hackney 1b 521 <<<
Silvey William Parkes Hackney 1b 521
1871
Emma Marshall Married born 1843 Shoreditch a Box Maker
Son Fred Marshall born 1861 Shoreditch
living with Emma's Parents
William Moore born 1813 a Tailor
Mary A Moore born 1807
This is the same family as in my last post (son Frederick has the same details and was the only one b in Shoreditch in 1860). Emma was called Emily before, but I guess it's the same person as he was already married to Emily by 1861.
Marriages Sep 1859
Herbert Mary Ann Hackney 1b 521
Macpherson Harriet Pancras 1b 521
Marshall Frederick Hackney 1b 521 <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Moore Emily Hackney 1b 521 <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Silvey William Parkes Hackney 1b 521
Phoenix thanks very much I was looking for a marriage for a Emma not a Emily ?? obviously I was wrong and you have solved something I have been looking at for months .
So this Emma I found in 1871 with her parents is probably her .??
Thnaks very much Merry yes thats the one I found but now I am wondering where the daughter Mary Ann was????
If Emma/Emily is back with her parents in 1871, is she a widow? Her little family may have broken up, with children farmed out to sisters, or in school/hosptial etc.
I'm so pleased I put this on here had instant response
thanks Phoenix thats the thing she isnt a widow it says Married ???
Wonder if he was alive when his daughter married she doesnt say deceased ????
There is this:
Deaths Mar 1871 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Marshall Fred 0 Wortley 9c 120
Marshall Frederick 14 Mansfield 7b 52
Marshall Frederick 33 Bethnal Green 1c 263
I know she says widow - but he's just the right age. Have you found Emma in 1881?
oops just amended my post as it does not say he is deceased on Mary Anns Marriage ???
and no I have not found Emma or Emily yet after 1871 but then I was looking for Emma not Emily so will have another look thanks very much for your help
I don't have Ancestry, but it would be worth looking for an Emily/Emma Marshall marrying after March 1871 - if she were widowed - and I can't find her in 1881 - she may well have wanted someone to help her with the children.
what I am not happy about is Mary Ann does not say her Father is deceased on her wedding in 1880 ???
I have now found her in 1851 thanks to you and Merry
Margaret in Burton
23-07-10, 15:10
Val
Just because it doesn't say he is deceased doesn't mean he wasn't. It would depend how the question was asked.
e.g. "father name and occupation"
If they didn't ask if he was still alive and she didn't volunteer the info then it wouldn't say it.
Prime example is my own parents marriage cert. Mum's dad died when mum was 11. He was her father, she was the youngest of 7 and he is named on her birth cert.
Marriage cert has a line through fathers name. It is the original copy so no mistakes in transcribing. I can only imagine when asked her fathers name she said she didn't have one, not that he was deceased. She passed away before I started all of this and dad doesn't remember what was said.
thanks for your response Margaret I know what you mean ,its just that I suppose I am being over cautious so pleased to finally have the right family.
Thnaks to Phoenix and Merry have found quite a bit this afternoon and think that death for Fred is probably right
I am getting really confused ???
Two of Mary Ann Marshalls children were taken by Dr Barnados to Canada in 1896 after she died in 1895, now a a contact tells me that Frederick Marshall their Grandfather took them from there to New York about 1910 ??? if thats so where is he in 1871 onwards in England ???? and I still cannot find Mary Ann Marshall born 1864 Shoreditch in 1871 ????? before she marries ?
Anybody please.
He would have been 70-odd if he was alive then. Not saying he couldn't have done it (though it would be difficult if he was dead!)
thanks Merry I do wonder if she has any concrete evidence of this???and surely if they had been placed in Homes in Canada they would not be able to be taken out just like that?
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