View Full Version : help please to identify 3 people (kemp)
my grandmother was anne lister born 1881 died 1968 married george kemp born 1881 died 1960 lived in hunslet leeds where mum was born.is there a census with these on with my grandparents?
my mother was born 1914 elsie v kemp ,annie,muriel e, kenneth v,loui,
i have now come across 3 names i didnt know but ancestry has them with my grandmother
name removed,gilbert,name removed:confused:and has them with my grandparents as there parents
thankyou brenda xxx
Margaret in Burton
06-05-10, 16:18
The latest census available to view for England and Wales is the 1911, you need credits on the official site.
http://www.1911census.co.uk/
or FMP
http://www.findmypast.co.uk
Before that it's 1841, 1851, 1861, 1871, 1881, 1891 and 1901 on Ancestry or FMP
Margaret in Burton
06-05-10, 16:21
Would they be married on the 1911 census?
kiterunner
06-05-10, 16:27
I can't see a George Kemp / Anne Lister marriage on FreeBMD, but there is a possible James Kemp / Annie Lister marriage Jan-Mar 1910 Holbeck district; could that be them?
Bren, do you know for sure that all the people you mentioned in your post are no longer living? If some of them could still be alive (for instance, the ones you've never heard of), we might have to delete their names.
Margaret in Burton
06-05-10, 16:30
I can't see a George Kemp or Anne Lister born around 1881 in the Hunslet area of Leeds in 1911 either.
kiterunner
06-05-10, 16:32
Anyway, looking at the dates the births were registered, I don't think they could all be from the same family. Some are much too close together. I expect the person who has the tree on ancestry just found all the Kemp / Lister births and assumed they all belonged to the same parents instead of checking.
I checked on Yorkshire BMD and James Kemp married Annie Lister 1910 at Holbeck District Registered Building.
kiterunner
06-05-10, 16:46
Bren, on your own trees on ancestry you have Anne's husband as James and her father as George Lister.
kiterunner
06-05-10, 16:57
Gilbert Kemp died age 0 in 1924 but I can't see a death for the other boy and I can't find anything about the girl, not even the tree on ancestry with her name in, so I'm going to delete their names for now, Bren. Anyway, I'm sure that Gilbert and the other boy don't belong to your family because their birth registrations don't fit.
Margaret in Burton
06-05-10, 18:03
Even James Kemp born 1881 doesn't appear on the 1911 in the Hunslet area.
A reference from the 1901 would help.
kiterunner
06-05-10, 18:36
I found an Annie Kemp age 31, married 1 year +-1, in Leeds on the 1911 but there didn't seem to be a James with her. I had to get off the computer before I'd finished with it though! I can't remember whether she was in Hunslet or not.
I found James and Annie Kemp with a son called George aged 5mths in 1911 in Hunslet, but the parents are aged 22 and 21 not around 30, (from the index only).
I see you have James as James E Kemp on your ancestry trees. You said he died in 1960 in your first post. The reg in 1860 is for James E Kemp aged 71 which matches the age in 1911 but not the born about 1881 you mentioned. Same goes for Annie - she was 78 when she died in 1968 so age matching 1911 again.
Place of birth Bradford for him and Hunslet for her in 1911.
Well, lets hope that isn't the right family as James Kemp from Bradford would appear to have been born in 1888 and the son of Hirst and Laura Kemp and not the son of William Kemp and Mary Jane Creaser.
If there's any confusion, what does the marriage cert say for James Kemp's father?
Now I'm panicking as you don't have the marriage on your Ancestry tree.
Things are better with Annie Lister as her parents do seem to be George and Julia, but she is aged one in 1891 so not born in 1881.
Margaret in Burton
06-05-10, 19:41
I'll look it up on the 1911 when we get the right info. Seems like a lot of things don't add up at the moment.
Anyway, looking at the dates the births were registered, I don't think they could all be from the same family. Some are much too close together. I expect the person who has the tree on ancestry just found all the Kemp / Lister births and assumed they all belonged to the same parents instead of checking.
I checked on Yorkshire BMD and James Kemp married Annie Lister 1910 at Holbeck District Registered Building.
james is right ...yes all the one,s i know are dead.the others im not sure brenda xxx
I see you have James as James E Kemp on your ancestry trees. You said he died in 1960 in your first post. The reg in 1860 is for James E Kemp aged 71 which matches the age in 1911 but not the born about 1881 you mentioned. Same goes for Annie - she was 78 when she died in 1968 so age matching 1911 again.
your right im going to have to get all my info out and look up...ancestry said mother was lister to the 3 new ones...brenda xxx
Things are better with Annie Lister as her parents do seem to be George and Julia, but she is aged one in 1891 so not born in 1881.
anne parents are julie emma nee holder and george lister.brenda xxx
It's the parents of James that is the problem Bren. You have his father as William Kemp and I think his father is Hirst Kemp.
Do you actually have a copy of James and Annie's marriage cert?
Margaret in Burton
06-05-10, 21:17
your right im going to have to get all my info out and look up...ancestry said mother was lister to the 3 new ones...brenda xxx
Do you not check it yourself?
I would never take any info given by someone else as right without checking it myself.
kiterunner
06-05-10, 22:08
Bren, are you talking about someone's tree on ancestry which has those extra 3 children in your family? Or are you saying you looked for all births with surname Kemp and mother's maiden name Lister on the GRO birth index? In which case you would surely expect to find some that aren't in your family but just happen to have parents with the same surnames?
kite thankyou when i went on my tree it gave me these 3 names as a poss match...i wondered had i missed something as it gave mothers name as lister and i wondered had these died as young children thats why i didnt know if they were familyornot.....i only learnt of aunt emily because of my oldest brother said she died at the age of 4 through burns and shock and that my mum was the cause.
yes margereti usually do check but i was busy yesturday and didnt get the notes out...which was lazy of me..but i beleive census,s to be right.i cant check the latest census as i havent pais so i kindly asked for help.brenda xxx
kiterunner
07-05-10, 07:17
Oh well, the ancestry hint was wrong. I always ignore them myself.
It's the parents of James that is the problem Bren. You have his father as William Kemp and I think his father is Hirst Kemp.
Do you actually have a copy of James and Annie's marriage cert?
again im going to check what i do have i know i have a census somewhere in the notes from when i was on wdytyr.....i know my grandmother divorced grandad and took up with someone she didnt marry.thankyou for you quick help brenda xxx
this is grandads parents
This record has been added to your shoebox.
1881 England Census
about James Kemp
Name: James Kemp
Relation: Son
Father's Name: William
Mother's Name: Mary J.
Gender: Male
Where born: Aldbrough, Yorkshire, England
Civil parish: Aldbrough in Skirlaugh
County/Island: Yorkshire
Country: England
Household Members: Name Age
William Kemp 46
Mary J. Kemp 41
John W. Kemp 21
Arthur W. Kemp 20
Walter Kemp 14
Alice Kemp 10
Amelia Kemp 8
James Kemp
Ann E. Speck 49
this is grandads parents
But I don't think they are, Bren.......
It seems that James Edward Kemp b 1881 who was the son of William Kemp and Mary didn't marry your Annie Lister. He married Martha Elizabeth Gertrude Jones in 1908 and they are together in 1911. James is showing as born in Aldbrough and aged 30 in 1911 with Martha as his wife.
I think your James Kemp was not born until 1888 and he was from Bradford.
I think this is the birth reg for your James:
Births Sep 1888
KEMP James Bradford Y 9b 56
Obviously I can't be 100% certain as I don't have James' marriage cert to Annie Lister, but then I don't think you have it either, do you?
Margaret in Burton
07-05-10, 12:09
But I don't think they are, Bren.......
It seems that James Edward Kemp b 1881 who was the son of William Kemp and Mary didn't marry your Annie Lister. He married Martha Elizabeth Gertrude Jones in 1908 and they are together in 1911. James is showing as born in Aldbrough and aged 30 in 1911 with Martha as his wife.
I think your James Kemp was not born until 1888 and he was from Bradford.
I think this is the birth reg for your James:
Births Sep 1888
KEMP James Bradford Y 9b 56
Obviously I can't be 100% certain as I don't have James' marriage cert to Annie Lister, but then I don't think you have it either, do you?
Oh the perils of not getting certs. I did that a few years back and did 200 years worth of research and then discovered it was the wrong family when I finally did get the marriage cert.
james kemp and annie lister married march 1910
holbeck volume 9b page 926
this was found for me on ftf 2007
if i send for the cert do i put down what i have here?brenda xxx
If you get the copy cert from the GRO then you can quote those refs etc.
If you are getting it from the local office then you can use their application on Yorks BMD. Here it is:
http://www.yorkshirebmd.info/cgi/pma.cgi?date=1910&county=yorkshire&reference=LS%3AHOLBECKRB%2F13%2F30&file=K&pos=6064&surname=LISTER&forename=Annie&area=LS
You just need to print it off and fill it out.
thankyou merry...is this the one thats £7 just seen its £9 lolxxx brenda xxx
kiterunner
07-05-10, 17:43
It's gone up, Bren - think it's £9.25 now.
right thankyou will send £9.25
brenda xxx
kiterunner
07-05-10, 17:47
Oops, if it says £9 it is £9, sorry, think you edited your post while I was typing!
lol thankyou have a good night brenda xxx
It's the parents of James that is the problem Bren. You have his father as William Kemp and I think his father is Hirst Kemp.
Do you actually have a copy of James and Annie's marriage cert?
http://i311.photobucket.com/albums/kk479/brendamccartie/georgelisterandjuliaemma.jpg
his father was william on his marriage lines i have found brenda xxx
Margaret in Burton
08-05-10, 13:24
http://i311.photobucket.com/albums/kk479/brendamccartie/georgelisterandjuliaemma.jpg
his father was william on his marriage lines i have found brenda xxx
That is the marriage cert of George Lister. Merry is referring to James Kemp and Annie Lister's marriage cert.
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