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having spent hours and hours to no avail trying to find my grandfather robert girling, what if i try to look for brothers or sisters, presuming he had some, how would i go about it
the only things i know is my father albert girling was born in liverpool in 1912, the whole family are in liverpool, but the marriage took place in islington london in 1915, i presume they did not want anyone in liverpool to know they had 2 boys before getting married
now i know you have to post the bans some weeks before so maybe they used his parents home to do that and pretended they lived there, on the marriage certificate it has fathers name as harry girling - superintendent of trams, which could fit london
they used the address of 89 norbreck road, finsbury park, who's home was this, they married at the church of the sacred heart edon grove, islington
if this is tied into the family how can i search for siblings, on the certificate robert girling s down as 36, so a birth around 1879, any thoughts please
kiterunner
24-03-10, 17:00
Are you sure it says Norbreck Road? I can't find one in London.
i think so, might be gone now, again had to rely on sister reading it?
I'm not having any luck with Norb* or *breck Road in Finsbury in 1881, 1891, 1901 or 1911 so I expect it's been read incorrectly. I don't know the area, so am not much help.
maggie_4_7
24-03-10, 17:45
Is it definitely written Norbreck because there is a Brecknock Rd.
Edit to say: I know this is going to sound silly but there was a Norbreck Rd in Lancashire and a Finsbury Park in Cheshire and an Islington in Liverpool! Is it definitely London?
london for sure, found the marriage on family search as well
hi merry, just rang my sister and got her to look at it again, it is definitely 89, same with road, same with finsbury park, the name is the hard to read bit , starts with a h or w or n then ordsbrek, could be wordsbrek maybe, can't see another letter on the certificate to compare it with, hope this helps
Olde Crone
24-03-10, 18:28
Was the marriage by Banns?
It's a bit odd, because Eden Grove is in Holloway, which isn't really either Finsbury Park OR Islington.
I am not familiar with RC parishes though, so maybe the RC parish was a lot bigger than the C of E one.
OC
on the certificate it says eden grove islington holloway and it is rc
maggie_4_7
24-03-10, 18:36
Holloway is in the Borough of Islington and it was then also Finsbury Park is in the London Borough of Hackney. Both boroughs are next door to each other.
They are large London Borough urban areas as well as original parishes.
Edit to say: Finsbury on the other hand is also in Islington but its a different place to Finsbury Park.
maggie_4_7
24-03-10, 18:53
Sorry I'm probably confusing you Finsbury Park and Holloway are next door to each other.
Still doesn't get you nearer to why they were there of course :)
I've looked through all the 89s in Finsbury Park in 1911 looking for a road name to fit, but didn't see anything.
Olde Crone
24-03-10, 19:19
Maggie
Yes, next door to each other, but different parishes. I wondered how they got away with giving an addy in one parish but marrying in another, if the mariage was by Banns, I didn't think you could do that? It's probably irrelevant, I know!
There IS a Norbreck Gardens in NW10 but I don't think that could be right - also it looks like a modern development.
The Islington/Holloway area suffered bombing during WW2 and also had a good old slum clearance in the late1900s, so maybe Norbreck Rd came and went? I lived in Finsbury Park in the late 1960s but don't remember a Norbreck Rd...not that that means anything of course, I can hardly remember my own name these days.
OC
Is it definite that there is no C in it before the K now?
its hard to read but she thinks yes
Does it say how old Robert Girling was when he married ?
To find his brothers and sisters, you will need his approx age and see if you can find him with a Harry Girling father, in one of the censuses. This will at least give some idea where he was born and age bracket to start searching BDM records.
Was Alfred born 1912, their first child ? I am not getting any results in 1911 census for Robert Girling in Liverpool or with Mary Girling. Perhaps they were not together in March/April 1911.
Di
Di, If you type Robert Girling in he search box for the forums you will see this is not the first thread about him. I don't have time now to look through the 170+ other posts :o, but from memory we have been unable to find Robert or Mary or those children (2?) b before the 1911 census on the 1911. We have Robert's age at marriage (36??) but that hasn't helped. We have not been able to find Robert with his father on any census either. I don't think (less sure on this!) that Robert has died yet either! :rolleyes:
maggie_4_7
25-03-10, 06:19
Probably a good idea to merge the threads together then :rolleyes:
Bidston
Also might be an idea to actually get the copies of certs and scan them in and put cropped bits on the forum so other people can actually see the writing. What some people see other people see different things. Everyone is working blind and going over old ground that other people have worked on and it gets confusing especially when typos appear in another post on a place name or persons name!
hi maggie, appreciate your efforts, first boy robert frederick girling born south sheffield 22 aug 1910, only have short copy of birth so no details, my father albert henry girling born liverpool 4 july 1912, marriage of parents not until 1915
my original post was not to have people go over old ground but to get a few tips from the very experienced members here how i might identify brothers or sisters, sure there must have been some, in order to track down great grandparents, for a new boy like me its hard knowing where to look next but the help from experienced members is invaluable, i know some people here have hundreds of ancestors on their family tree and i cant find my grandfather so you can see my level of expertise, really do appreciate the help given here as i am sure many newbies do, thanks again
Bidston......
Sorry I can't really help here, but I'd just like to tell you not to give up. I've had some real breakthroughs from help given by some of these people.
I know sometimes you feel like you can't get anywhere, then suddenly someone will have a brainstorm and it will fall into place.
I have my tree back many generations, but still can't find my half-brother...
Good Luck.
kiterunner
25-03-10, 10:30
Sorry to say this, but I think we would need to be able to look at an image of the actual marriage certificate to be able to help with this one.
hi kiterunner, will try and get my sister to send it to a cousin and get him to scan it for me, will report back in the future when i eventually get it, thanks
maggie_4_7
25-03-10, 17:41
hi maggie, appreciate your efforts, first boy robert frederick girling born south sheffield 22 aug 1910, only have short copy of birth so no details, my father albert henry girling born liverpool 4 july 1912, marriage of parents not until 1915
Yeah I do think Kiterunner is right about the image.
ooooh same birthday as me 4th July mine is some years later than that though :)
I'm sure you'll get there in the end.
I don't recognise Norbreck Road. But Eden Grove is a road running west off Holloway Road and very near Holloway Road tube station. The road immediately below Eden Grove is George's Road where my paternal grandmother Annie Eliza Matthews was born in 1876.
Holloway is in Islington borough.
This is a parish boundary map for the church
http://www.rcdow.org.uk/fileupload/sitebuilder_boundaries/Holloway122010531047.jpg
Looking at the boundary map at likely places that could be misread as Norbreck there's
Morland Mews
Brooksby Street
Laycock Street
Rowstock Gardens
but I might be clutching straws here! It's perfectly possible the road has been renamed or demolished.
But the more I think about it the more I think Brecknock Road is most likely and either your sister misread or the person recording it got their syllables back to front.
hey, thanks for that nell, will run those past my sister, see if they jump out at her, much appreciated
Going back to basics
Births Sep 1912
Girling Albert H Jones W.Derby 8b 1214
is this the right birth?
Do you have the cert?
maggie_4_7
28-03-10, 08:19
But the more I think about it the more I think Brecknock Road is most likely and either your sister misread or the person recording it got their syllables back to front.
That's the first road I thought of and Brecknock Rd on your map is right on the boundary so I suppose its possible.
hi jess, yes that's the birth, registered address was 13 auburn road, tuebrook, liverpool, old victorian terraced housing that's still there, i went and had a look about 20 years ago, father robert girling - artist, mother mary jones
hi all, just spoke to sister in u.k. on the phone and ran those address's past her, none fit, she will send the certificate to my cousin who will scan it and sent it to me, then i can post it, with a bit of technical help, and hopefully we can get a result, cheers all
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