Liverpool/Birkenhead records

[Anstey Nomad]

I am looking at a friend's father's family as he knows absolutely nothing and is beginning to feel it.

His grandparents were killed, possibly separately, in WW2, and after some time living on the streets, his father was adopted by a relative.

Friend is sure that all local records were destroyed in the Blitz. I was hopeful that national records would fill the gap, but now I can't find a birth registration for his father under what friend believes was his birth name.

Is it possible that local records did not make it up to national level, or does anyone who has done research in this area know any more?

Thanks

[Merry]

I've already been looking at this last night (saw FB post).

There are no WW2 civilian war casualties in the surname mentioned, but were the grandparents supposed to have that surname?

Does your contact know what is written on the 1963 (? from memory!) marriage cert (father's name/occ and address for groom, witness names) or 1971 death cert (place of birth) - any clues there?

If his father was adopted by a relative is that where the surname comes from? Was he supposed to be with the mystery grandparents before that?

Loads of other questions, but have to go and pick up my Tesco order now!

EDIT - Also, any knowledge of any other relatives on father's side? Aunts, uncles, cousins etc. Anything at all could give a breakthrough!

[Margaret in Burton]

Maybe ask Allan (Garstonite)

[Merry]

Reading Marg's post made me realise you haven't said where 'local' is! I took it to be Liverpool too, from FB. (EDIT - obvs I didn't bother reading the thread title!)

I have never heard that there was ever any issue with civil records in Liverpool, nor with the transfer of those records to the GRO etc. Maybe there are missing records for some institutions such as children's homes or similar though.

all local records were destroyed in the Blitz.

TBH it sounds like something someone might say to cover for the fact they don't know about their early years or don't have a birth cert etc.

[Merry]

If the person in Q was using the name they had as an adult in 1939, then in theory, if their dob on the Register was the same as on their death cert, their record should have been opened by FMP already. Obviously this doesn't always happen, but in this case it's probably more likely they are on the register in a different name and the record is closed.

The way forward may lie in discovering more about the grandparents.

[Olde Crone]

(Aside - just to say what a refreshing change to hear that "all records were destroyed in the blitz" rather than "all records were destroyed in a fire", which is the normal retort of the jobsworth official.)

OC

[Anstey Nomad]

Well, I've cross checked a couple of people I know were born in Liverpool in the war years and I can report that J W Lennon and J P McCartney are all present and correct!

The surname in the FB post is the adoptive surname under which he later married and died. Whether this is the surname of the paternal grandparents I don't know yet. I have the alleged birth name, but can't find a birth registration in England and Wales to match it.

I will try FMP tomorrow. the 1939 Register on Ancestry is not yielding any clues.

Anyway, the answer to the question, unless Allan knows differently, is that great lawyers' stand by, " not so far as we are aware."

Thanks

[Mary from Italy]

Might be worth starting a thread on the Sensitive Research board, which doesn't get picked up by Google, so you can post names (except of living people) and dates.

[Anstey Nomad]

Thanks Mary. I might do that, but I'm not quite there yet.

[Tilly Mint]

I've pm-ed you.

[maggie_4_7]

Quite a lot of trees on Ancestry with the name, all born and lived around the Liverpool area, so once you have some concrete evidence ie names registered and used of grandparents and also the information Merry has listed if possible it probably won't be too difficult .

[Merry]

Have you tried using the supposed birth surname as mmm with nothing in the main surname field?

[maggie_4_7]

Have you tried using the supposed birth surname as mmm with nothing in the main surname field?

I assume you're asking Anstey this question but I did, bearing in mind the registration is probably in the Jan qtr of the next year and I found nothing. In fact I looked in Scotland and Ireland, but I didn't search NI records.

It's irritating because the name at time of death isn't probably the name on the birth registration so the 1939 Register won't marry up birth and death so will be closed and remain closed. Of course I would think the name is a name in the family.

[Merry]

I thought AN had been told what the birth surname was supposed to be and that was the name she couldn't find a reg for, when she wrote:

I have the alleged birth name, but can't find a birth registration in England and Wales to match it.

[Merry]

I see the Ancestry tree for the family says Birkenhead rather than Liverpool for the birth that can't be found. The tree uses the post adoption surname.

[Anstey Nomad]

Meet me over in Sensitive Research!

I give in

[maggie_4_7]

I thought AN had been told what the birth surname was supposed to be and that was the name she couldn't find a reg for, when she wrote:


Oh okay, missed that bit.