View Full Version : Who is William/Philip William Tracey?
Sussex Maid
27-09-19, 21:44
This man is proving very difficult to find, the only information I have is that he is named as the father at the baptisms of -
Lizzie Blanche Tracey 6 Jul 1858 Twickenham (William Tracey/Mary Julia Tracey)
Alice Jane Tracey 11 Dec 1859 Old Church St Pancras (Philip William Tracey/Mary Jane Tracey)
Frances Mabel Tracey 13 Nov 1862 Old Church St Pancras (Philip William Tracey/Mary Jane Tracey)
All the birth registrations have mmn Thomas but I have not been able to find a marriage to Mary Jane Thomas.
He is not with Mary Jane and the children in 1861 https://www.ancestry.co.uk/interactive/8767/KENRG9_459_462-0070/6952486?backurl=
Any help appreciated
Have you tried Ireland? Tracey is a common Irish name.
Mary seems to have married Clememt W Strong in 1866 at Brighton. Her name is given as Mary Jane Thomas, so quite likely never to have been married to Mr Trac(e)y.
Clement William Strong died in 1869. There are two entries in the probate register for him (no will - just administration). No mention of a wife in either of those, just a brother and sister. Looks as if his estate was not dealt with fully for a long time (the second entry being 20 years after his death). The valuation of his estate changed dramatically between the two entries!
I haven't found Mary Strong in 1871 as yet, but this looks like her in 1881:
https://www.ancestry.co.uk/interactive/7572/LNDRG11_10_15-0877/13070121?backurl=&ssrc=&backlabel=Return
with Alice J 21 and Frances M Strong 20 both born Surrey.
I found the above from looking for stuff on people with forenames Lizzie Blanche (very uncommon combo!) and turned up this probate which also mentions Alice Jane.
https://www.ancestry.co.uk/interactive/1904/31874_221851-00361/2881192?backurl=https://www.ancestry.co.uk/family-tree/person/tree/35472601/person/372126589805/facts
From there I found a tree with Clement William Strong etc. The tree has nothing more about Mr Tracy except that the tree owner has presumed he died before 1866, which he may or may not have done!
Mary is not poor in 1861: she is supported by a fundholding, has a cook, and a monthly nurse to help with the baby.
I see that (Philip) William Tracey is described as a gentleman. I wonder if that is actually his name. One wonders if there is another establishment, far from the seclusion of Twickenham, where he is happily esconced with wife and family?
There's an obit for Clement Strong - Illustrated London News 16 October 1869 (FMP), but it only mentions his army career.
Frances Mabel 'Strong' married in 1885 (LMA Ancestry) and named her father as Clement Strong, Colonel Coldstream Guards.
The image for Mary's marriage to Clement is online at family search, but you have to browse to find it.
I note that in 1841, Mary's father is not at home. He is a mineralogist!
I feel DNA test are required!
It would be interesting to see where Clement was c 1861 and at the conception of the girls.
Alice Strong is with her widowed sister Frances M Hadden in 1939:
https://www.ancestry.co.uk/interactive/61596/tna_r39_1649_1649h_011/15890353?backurl=http%3a%2f%2fsearch.ancestry.co.u k%2fcgi-bin%2fsse.dll%3fdbid%3d61596%26gsfn%3dalice%2bj%26 gsln%3dstrong%26gsfn_x%3d1%26gsln_x%3d1%26cp%3d11% 26qh%3dXcn35vyMFVLJRMVW3VEHlQ%253d%253d%26hc%3d50% 26new%3d1%26rank%3d1%26uidh%3d672%26redir%3dfalse&backlabel=ReturnSearchResults
None of which helps with Mr Tracy. I agree with Phoenix about him possibly having another family elsewhere. Interesting that he didn't think of including the name Philip until after the baptism of his first child with Mary!
Also interesting that the first child was baptised near where they (or Mary anyway) were living. The other two away from Richmond.
I feel DNA test are required!
It would be interesting to see where Clement was c 1861 and at the conception of the girls.
lol!
In 1861 he's a visitor at Digswell, Herts. Unmarried Lieut. Col. Coldstream Guards. b Westerham, Kent.
So, not especially helpful, except that he was free to marry....
I did look for Strong/Thomas births 1866-1870, but there were none in London/Surrey/Sussex.
Mary's early life a mystery too: I cannot find a marriage for her parents, nor what happens to mother Phillipa...
Have to go out, just when it's getting fascinating!
Sussex Maid
28-09-19, 09:19
Harry's Mum/Merry and Phoenix - thank you for looking at this for me and for confirming what I have found.
I came to Mr Tracey, through the Strong family, when I couldn't find any birth registrations for the 'supposed' Strong/Thomas daughters of Mary Jane.
Phoenix - where did you find Mary in 1841 please? I have only been able to find her in 1861 and 1881.
I found the baptism of a Mary Jane on Find My Past, and her living with her mother in Plymouth in 1841. I'll see if I can locate it on Ancestry...
kiterunner
28-09-19, 10:28
1860 Post Office London Suburban Court Directory:
https://www.ancestry.co.uk/interactive/61265/47056_263021009499_1477-00683?pid=10632748&treeid=&personid=&rc=&usePUB=true&_phsrc=Ctf15960&_phstart=successSource
Tracey Philip William, 5 Merton Villas, Cambrian Road, Richmond.
Also in the Street Directory of the same year with an "esq".
https://www.ancestry.co.uk/interactive/61265/47056_263021009499_1477-00417?pid=10586913&treeid=&personid=&rc=&usePUB=true&_phsrc=Ctf15960&_phstart=successSource
Sussex Maid
28-09-19, 11:18
I think I have found the 1841 census - Union Street Plymouth; Philippa Thomas, 30 is the mineralogist with Mary Thomas age 5. I don't have a sub to FMP but assume the baptism is 1833 at St Andrew Plymouth father William mother Philippa - does the register give the occupation of William as mineralogist?
KiteRunner - Thank you for the directory entries, at least I know that there was a person called Philip William Tracey :-)
does the register give the occupation of William as mineralogist?
I looked at that earlier and I think it said mineral dealer.
When Mary marries, by licence, she is living in Lewisham, Kent and gives father William as a gentleman. Presumably the girls did not attend the wedding?
Where did you see the marriage, Phoenix?
It's on family search. (image 98 of 532)
What is really odd is that he describes himself as a gentleman, when I think he was a Colonel by that stage. He retired on half pay in March 1867 but had already been clapped up in an asylum on 27 November 1866, where he died in 1869.
Presumably, any will he made would be set aside because he was a lunatic. The obituaries mention his service in the army, his parents, but are tight-lipped about his marriage.
One wonders whether his brother, who didn't administer the estate, despite being a Registrar of the Probate etc division of the High Court of Justice, stepped in quickly to prevent Mary Jane grabbing the cash!
I looked on FS but found nothing! Just people with a similar name but in the US :(
It's film 004427388
Look for marriage of Clement William Strong to Mary Jane Thomas - Brighton 19 May 1866.
Click on the page link on the right hand side. As it invites you to browse, select image 98. And blow it up massively.
Thank you, I found it that time!
One wonders whether his brother, who didn't administer the estate, despite being a Registrar of the Probate etc division of the High Court of Justice, stepped in quickly to prevent Mary Jane grabbing the cash!
The same brother was a witness at the wedding!
Sussex Maid
28-09-19, 22:34
"I looked at that earlier and I think it said mineral dealer" - thank you Merry.
I have a copy of Mary Jane Strong's Will and, although she named Henry Linwood Strong, her brother-in-law, as one of the executors he 'renounced the Probate and Execution thereof' - the gross value of the personal estate was £4727-18-8.
I am waiting for a copy of the Will of Henry Linwood Strong plus the Letters of Administration/s for Clement.
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