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kiterunner
08-05-17, 12:19
The image isn't very clear for this (and I also looked on The Genealogist but it was no better).

This is the link to the ancestry copy:
https://www.ancestry.co.uk/interactive/5111/40611_310345-00076/706259?backurl=http%3a%2f%2fsearch.ancestry.co.uk% 2fcgi-bin%2fsse.dll%3f_phsrc%3dCtf786%26_phstart%3dsucce ssSource%26usePUBJs%3dtrue%26db%3dCanturburyPrerog ativeCourt%26gss%3dangs-d%26new%3d1%26rank%3d1%26msT%3d1%26MS_AdvCB%3d1%26 gskw%3dwre*h*m*%26gskw_x%3d1%26MSAV%3d2%26MSV%3d0% 26uidh%3dvm5%26gl%3d%26gst%3d%26hc%3d10%26fh%3d150 %26fsk%3dBELq368IgAAT9wAMwa8-61-&ssrc=&backlabel=ReturnSearchResults#?imageId=40611_31034 5-00077

The left-hand page (Edward Thomas of Wrexham, written 16 May 1659 and proved 19 Oct 1660). I'm only interested in the bit about the Buttall family, starting on line 20. This is what I have so far:

Item I leave and bequeath To Rainard Buttalls Sonne the Sum[m]e of Twentie Shillinges which was a certaine Sum[m]e, which I was not Certaine whether I had or noe, to his father when wee were in Oswestrey, and therefore in Discharge of my Conscience Knoweinge not whether I have paied itt or noe I leave him that Menconed Sum[m]e.

Can anybody decipher those two words, please? And spot any mistakes I've made with the rest!

My ancestor Randle Buttall of Wrexham died in 1684. I don't know his father's name, nor when the father died. The surname is Butter in the 17th century Wrexham parish registers but Buttall in wills etc. Randle's first name has a lot of variants in the PR's especially as some are in Latin. Rainard could well be Randle, but wouldn't Edward have left the money to Randle rather than his son in that case? Do you think Rainard could be Randle's father? (Or uncle.)

ElizabethHerts
08-05-17, 12:28
"in discharge of my Confidence" ?

"... or noe I leave him that Menconed sume."

Menconed = abbreviation for "mentioned".


Sume with one m.

ElizabethHerts
08-05-17, 12:28
Is the place "Oswestrey"?

kiterunner
08-05-17, 12:33
It is Discharge, thanks Elizabeth! Now I realise the word is Conscience, not Confidence. I think I read it as Conscience late last night but forgot. And it must be Knowinge, not Knowings. I'll put the corrections into the original post in a minute.

Thanks very much indeed for that "Oswestrey"! It does look right and is very interesting. I'll look into that.

ElizabethHerts
08-05-17, 12:37
I was very pleased to be able to help, Kate! Sometimes you need more than one pair of eyes.

kiterunner
08-05-17, 13:03
Twenty shillings would be quite a large debt to forget whether you'd paid or not in those days, wouldn't it? And if Rainard was Randle then I would have thought he would send someone to ask him whether he'd paid it back or not, so I'm thinking Rainard must be the previous generation.