William and Mary Marshall, descendants of Dorothy Chadder

[tpb]

I am interested in William Marshall, born probably between 1805 and 1815 (not later), son of Dr. Richard Marshall and Jane Farwell, both of Totnes, Devon, and his wife, also his first cousin, Mary Benthall, born (then Mary Bentall) at Totnes on 10 December 1823, baptized 29 January 1824, daughter of William Searle Bent(h)all and Mary Ann Marshall, sister of Richard.

They were married on 23 September 1843 at St. George's Church, Hanover Square, London.

It is on record that he died on 28 October 1885 at Willen, Buckinghamshire, and that she died 27 April 1907, and was buried at Willen.

According to "Miscellanea Marescalliana, genealogical notes on the surname of Marshall" (1883) they had 8 children, but at least 3 (Richard, William Ernest and Laura) died young.

The others, Mary, Arthur, Herbert, Ellen Jane and Frederick, appear to have been alive when that book was compiled.

Dr. Richard Marshall was the second son of Dr. William Marshall, who married Dorothy Chadder, and there are other threads in this Forum about her sister.

I am interested to know where this family lived, and whether any of their children survived to have families of their own.

[kiterunner]

This is the the 1851 census (on ancestry):
http://interactive.ancestry.co.uk/8860/SRYHO107_1576_1576-0204/936457?backurl=http%3a%2f%2fsearch.ancestry.co.uk% 2fcgi-bin%2fsse.dll%3fdb%3duki1851%26gss%3dsfs28_ms_r_db %26new%3d1%26rank%3d1%26MS_AdvCB%3d1%26gsfn%3dmary %26gsfn_x%3d1%26gsln%3dmarshal*%26gsln_x%3d1%26msb dy%3d1824%26msbdy_x%3d1%26msbdp%3d5%26msbpn__ftp_x %3d1%26msrpn__ftp_x%3d1%26msypn__ftp_x%3d1%26mssng %3dwil*%26mssng_x%3d1%26gskw%3ddev*%26gskw_x%3d1%2 6MSAV%3d2%26uidh%3dvm5&ssrc=&backlabel=ReturnSearchResults
Larkhall Lane, Clapham, Surrey
William Marshall Head Mar 43 Clerk in the War Office Devon Totness
Mary Marshall Wife Mar 27 Devon Totness
Mary Marshall Daur 5 Surry Clapham
Arthur Marshall Son 2 Surry Clapham
Herbert Marshall Son 2 M Surry Clapham
+ 3 servants

[kiterunner]

And the 1861 census:
http://interactive.ancestry.co.uk/8767/MDXRG9_99_101-0225?pid=8556032&backurl=http%3a%2f%2fsearch.ancestry.co.uk%2f%2fcg i-bin%2fsse.dll%3findiv%3d1%26db%3duki1861%26gss%3da ngs-d%26new%3d1%26rank%3d1%26msT%3d1%26MS_AdvCB%3d1%26 gsfn%3dwil*%26gsfn_x%3d1%26gsln%3dmarsh*%26gsln_x% 3d1%26msbdy%3d1808%26msbdy_x%3d1%26msbdp%3d5%26msb pn__ftp_x%3d1%26msrpn__ftp_x%3d1%26msypn__ftp_x%3d 1%26gskw%3dtot*%26gskw_x%3d1%26MSAV%3d2%26uidh%3dv m5%26pcat%3d35%26fh%3d2%26h%3d8556032%26recoff%3d% 26ml_rpos%3d3&treeid=&personid=&hintid=&usePUB=true
19 Regents Pk Ter, St Pancras, Middlesex
William Marshall Head Mar 53 First Css Cl (War Office) Devon Totnes
Mary " Wife Mar 37 " "
" " Daur 15 Scholar Surrey Clapham
Arthur " Son 12 " " "
Herbert Marshall Son 10 Scholar Surrey Clapham
Ellen J " Daur 8(?) " "
Frederick " Son 3 London
+ 5 servants

[kiterunner]

1871 census, quite faint on ancestry:
http://interactive.ancestry.co.uk/7619/HRTRG10_1346_1349-0433/1583072?backurl=http%3a%2f%2fsearch.ancestry.co.uk %2fcgi-bin%2fsse.dll%3fdb%3duki1871%26gss%3dsfs28_ms_db%2 6new%3d1%26rank%3d1%26msT%3d1%26MS_AdvCB%3d1%26gsf n%3dwil*%26gsfn_x%3d1%26gsln%3dmarsh*%26gsln_x%3d1 %26msbdy%3d1808%26msbdy_x%3d1%26msbdp%3d5%26msbpn_ _ftp_x%3d1%26msrpn__ftp_x%3d1%26msypn__ftp_x%3d1%2 6gskw%3dtot*%26gskw_x%3d1%26MSAV%3d2%26uidh%3dvm5&ssrc=&backlabel=ReturnSearchResults

Grove(?) House, Church Gate, Cheshunt, Hertfordshire
William Marshall Head Mar 63 Retired Clerk of the War Office Devonshire Totnes
Mary do Mar 47 Do Do
Mary Do Daur Unm 25 Surrey Clapham
Arthur Do Son Unm 23 Undergraduate at ???? College Do Do
Herbert Do Son Unm 20 Clerk in the India Office Do Do
Ellen Jane Do Daur Unm 18 Do Do
Frederick Do Son 13 Scholar Regents Park Terrace
+ 5 servants

[kiterunner]

Then in 1881 they are in Croydon (I thought they would still be in Cheshunt and I could check the name of their house there!)

http://interactive.ancestry.co.uk/7572/SRYRG11_812_816-0086/21509861?backurl=http%3a%2f%2fsearch.ancestry.co.u k%2fcgi-bin%2fsse.dll%3fdb%3duki1881%26gss%3dsfs28_ms_db%2 6new%3d1%26rank%3d1%26msT%3d1%26MS_AdvCB%3d1%26gsf n%3dwil*%26gsfn_x%3d1%26gsln%3dmarsh*%26gsln_x%3d1 %26msbdy%3d1808%26msbdy_x%3d1%26msbdp%3d5%26msbpn_ _ftp_x%3d1%26msrpn__ftp_x%3d1%26msypn__ftp_x%3d1%2 6gskw%3dtot*%26gskw_x%3d1%26MSAV%3d2%26uidh%3dvm5&ssrc=&backlabel=ReturnSearchResults
Elmwood Road, Elmwood House, Croydon, Surrey
William Marshall Head Mar 73 Retired Clerk of the War Office Devonshire Totnes
Mary Do Wife Mar 57 Do Do
Mary Do Daur Unm 35 Surrey Clapham
Hebert Do Son Do 30 Junior Clerk India Office Do Do
Ellen Jane do Daur Do 28 Do Do
+ 1 servant

[tpb]

Wow! So quick. Thank you.

Here is a link to a portrait of Dorothy Chadder - not the most beguiling female ancestor.

http://www.nationaltrustcollections.org.uk/object/509842

[Kit]

Hello, those posts about her sister are mine, assuming you are referring to Sarah who married John Drake.

I don't think I've managed to trace any other Chadder children but I'll have a look later. I have to go out soon.

[Kit]

ok had a quick peek.

Mary Chadder married a William Adams in 1750 in Totnes.

They had 5 children but I haven't got any further than that. Not sure if I couldn't or if I got sidetracked and never went back.

[tpb]

I registered on this site yesterday because I found questions and some corroboration to my interest in the Chadder family.

Mary Bent(h)all was one of 15 siblings, (plus 6 cousins who became wards of the family when their parents died). I am attempting to summarize their lives and experiences in the context of the period. I am awed that this thread so quickly provided most of the details I was looking for to fill in a specific gaps in this effort.

I posted some information on the 'Sarah Chadder' thread, connecting the 3 Chadder sisters with the so-called 'Adams Bentall Marshall interest' that effectively controlled the elections of Totnes Members of Parliament from 1800 to 1832, and after.

The Marshall Miscellania book covers a lot of this ground. There are also academic biographies of Alfred Marshall that cover some of the 19th century descendants, but not always with 100% accuracy.

[Kit]

Hello I'll go and have a look at Sarah's thread.

Thanks for any information you have provided.

If you have any questions please ask, if I know I'll help otherwise someone on here will have a look for you. :)

[kiterunner]

1891 census:
http://interactive.ancestry.co.uk/6598/SSXRG12_765_767-0103/3811879?backurl=http%3a%2f%2fsearch.ancestry.co.uk %2fcgi-bin%2fsse.dll%3fdb%3duki1891%26gss%3dsfs28_ms_db%2 6new%3d1%26rank%3d1%26msT%3d1%26MS_AdvCB%3d1%26gsf n%3dmary%26gsfn_x%3d1%26gsln%3dmarsh*%26gsln_x%3d1 %26msbdy%3d1824%26msbdy_x%3d1%26msbdp%3d5%26msbpn_ _ftp_x%3d1%26msrpn__ftp_x%3d1%26msypn__ftp_x%3d1%2 6gskw%3dtot*%26gskw_x%3d1%26MSAV%3d2%26uidh%3dvm5&ssrc=&backlabel=ReturnSearchResults

28 Pevensey Rd, Hastings, Sussex
Mary Marshall Head Wdw 67 Gentlewoman Devonshire, Totnes
Do Do Daughter S 45 Do Surrey, Clapham
Ellen Jane Do Do S 38 Do Do Do
+ 2 servants

[kiterunner]

1901 census:
http://interactive.ancestry.co.uk/7814/SSXRG13_948_949-0319/6543862?backurl=http%3a%2f%2fsearch.ancestry.co.uk %2fcgi-bin%2fsse.dll%3fdb%3duki1901%26gss%3dsfs28_ms_db%2 6new%3d1%26rank%3d1%26msT%3d1%26MS_AdvCB%3d1%26gsf n%3dmary%26gsfn_x%3d1%26gsln%3dmarsh*%26gsln_x%3d1 %26msbdy%3d1824%26msbdy_x%3d1%26msbdp%3d5%26msbpn_ _ftp_x%3d1%26msrpn__ftp_x%3d1%26msypn__ftp_x%3d1%2 6gskw%3dtot*%26gskw_x%3d1%26MSAV%3d2%26uidh%3dvm5&ssrc=&backlabel=ReturnSearchResults

Woodgift, Crawley Rd, Horsham, Sussex
Mary Marshall Head Widow 76 Living on own means Devon Totnes
Ellen Jane Do Daugh S 48 Do Do Do Surrey Clapham
+ 2 servants

[kiterunner]

From the National Probate Calendar:
1907
MARSHALL Mary of "Woodgift" Horsham Sussex widow died 27 April 1907 Probate London 25 June to the reverend Frederick Marshall clerk and Ellen Jane Marshall spinster Effects £5115 14s 10d.

[kiterunner]

Now, as to whether any of William and Mary's children had families of their own.

This must be Frederick on the 1911 census:
http://interactive.ancestry.co.uk/2352/rg14_03180_0155_03/41701929?backurl=http%3a%2f%2fsearch.ancestry.co.u k%2fcgi-bin%2fsse.dll%3fdb%3d1911england%26gss%3dangs-d%26new%3d1%26rank%3d1%26msT%3d1%26MS_AdvCB%3d1%26 gsfn%3dfred*%26gsfn_x%3d1%26gsln%3dmarsh*%26gsln_x %3d1%26msbdy%3d1858%26msbdy_x%3d1%26msbdp%3d2%26ms bpn__ftp_x%3d1%26msrpn__ftp_x%3d1%26msypn__ftp_x%3 d1%26MSAV%3d2%26uidh%3dvm5%26gl%3d%26gst%3d%26hc%3 d10%26fh%3d10%26fsk%3dBEDmZmYIgAAJMAA-43-WFY-61-&backlabel=ReturnSearchResults

Ockley Rectory, Ockley, Surrey
Frederick Marshall Head 53 Married Clergyman Ch of England, born London
Margaret Helen Marshal Wife 42 Married 20 years, 4 children, 4 living, born Kents Bank(?) Lancashire
Eustace Arthur Marshall Son 17 Single School, born Leeds Yorks
Rosamund May Marshall Daughter 5 born Ockley, Surrey
Katherine Evangeline Marshall Daughter 3 born Ockley, Surrey
+ 2 servants

More National Probate Calendar entries:

1925
MARSHALL Ellen Jane of Woodgift Horsham Sussex spinster died 30 June 1925 Probate London 19 August to the reverend Frederick Marshall clerk. Effects £8377 0s 2d.

1885
MARSHALL William Esq. Personal Estate £5,150 11s 7d.
15 December. The Will of William Marshall formerly of Elmwood House North-park Croydon in the County of Surrey but late of 12 Ovington-square South Kensington in the County of Middlesex Esquire who died 28 October 1885 at 12 Ovington-square was proved at the Principal Registry by Mary Marshall of 12 Ovington-square Widow the Relict and Arthur Marshall of Egginton near Burton-on-Trent in the County of Stafford Civil Engineer Herbert Marshall of the India Office Westminster Esquire and the Reverend Frederick Marshall of Byfleet near Weybridge in the County of Surrey Clerk the Sons the Executors.

[kiterunner]

1889 MARSHALL Herbert, Personal Estate £3,184 14s 5d.
1 March. The Will of Herbert Marshall late of the India Office Westminster and of 7 Caroline-street Eaton-square both in the County of Middlesex Clerk in the India Office who died 16 February 1889 at Canbury House Kingston-on-Thames in the County of Surrey was proved at the Principal Registry by Arthur Marshall of Fair Oaks Addlestone in the County of Surrey Civil Engineer and the Reverend Frederick Marshall of Byfleet near Weybridge in the County of Surrey Clerk the Brothers the Executors.

So it doesn't look likely that Herbert married and had children, since he was unmarried on the 1881 census and no wife is mentioned in the probate entry.

[kiterunner]

Arthur in 1891:
http://interactive.ancestry.co.uk/6598/MDXRG12_1050_1053-0240/26753055?backurl=http%3a%2f%2fsearch.ancestry.co.u k%2fcgi-bin%2fsse.dll%3fdb%3duki1891%26gss%3dsfs28_ms_db%2 6new%3d1%26rank%3d1%26msT%3d1%26MS_AdvCB%3d1%26gsf n%3dart*%26gsfn_x%3d1%26gsln%3dmarsh*%26gsln_x%3d1 %26msbdy%3d1848%26msbdy_x%3d1%26msbdp%3d5%26msbpn_ _ftp_x%3d1%26msrpn__ftp_x%3d1%26msypn__ftp_x%3d1%2 6gskw%3dsur*%26gskw_x%3d1%26MSAV%3d2%26uidh%3dvm5&ssrc=&backlabel=ReturnSearchResults

South Mimms, Middlesex
Arthur Marshall Head S 42 Civil Engineer Surry Clapham
Edwin Birt Boarder M 26 Carpenter Berks
Sarah Do Housekeeper M 31 Domestic Servant
+ servant

National Probate Calendar:
1902
MARSHALL Arthur of Sonning Berkshire died 13 April 1901 Probate London 18 April to the reverend Frederick Marshall clerk and Godfrey Mosley solicitor Effects £567 9s 3d.

Just Mary jr to find now...

[kiterunner]

Not managed to trace Mary jr but since she was unmarried in 1891, age 45, she is unlikely to have had children.

[Virginia Denton]

Hello
All the names mentioned are in my family tree....would really like to hear from you...Virginia

[Kit]

Hello Virginia, how are you connected to the Chadders or Marshalls?

[tpb]

KiteRunner: thank you.
That is so much more than I expected when I posted this question. I have sent Virginia a separate note about the original Richard Marshall, Jane Farwell, Dorothy Chadder etc. If anyone else is interested I will be happy to share those details.

[Virginia Denton]

Hi Toni & tpb...
I inherited a diary written by my gtgt grandmother, who was obviously interested in family history...she has the Marshall line back to the "strong man of Ashprington, Rev. William Marshall. Her mother was Mary Ann, married to Edward James Thompson, Mary Ann was the daughter of Richard Marshall, Surgeon and Barrackmaster at Chatham...grandson Herbert was my grandmother's Godfather...St Mary's church at Totnes is a goldmine for imformation on this family...looking forward to more exchanges, Virginia