Parents of Joseph Butcher?

[Sue from Southend]

I've been looking at my 3x gt grandfather Joseph Butcher again, this is the link to him http://www.genealogistsforum.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=12586&highlight=joseph+butcher

I don't know why I've never done it before but I searched for "Miram Butcher" (his eldest daughter was baptised Ann Miram) and found a Whitechapel, London burial for Miram Butcher in 1810. Looking further back I found a marriage between James Butcher and Miram Chessen in 1791 in Wapping, Middlesex.

However the only baptism I can find is for John Isaac in Whitechapel, 1807. Surely there would have been other children in the previous 16 years? Where are they? Is one of them Joseph born 1796ish?

Any bright ideas warmly welcomed:d

[kiterunner]

This won't really help at the moment but I found a weird baptism entry which could be James:
http://interactive.ancestry.co.uk/1624/31281_A101161-00005/5518819?backurl=http%3a%2f%2fsearch.ancestry.co.uk %2fcgi-bin%2fsse.dll%3fdb%3dlmaearlyparish%26so%3d2%26pca t%3d34%26gss%3dangs-c%26new%3d1%26rank%3d1%26msT%3d1%26gsfn%3djohn%2bi s*c*%26gsfn_x%3d1%26gsln%3dbutch*r*%26gsln_x%3d1%2 6mswpn__ftp_x%3d1%26MSAV%3d2%26MS_AdvCB%3d1%26gskw _x%3d1%26_83004002_x%3d1%26cpxt%3d1%26cp%3d11%26ca tbucket%3drstp&backlabel=ReturnSearchResults

22 Jul 1764 at St Botolph, Aldersgate, City of London: James s of John & Isaac Butcher. Before I clicked to view the image, I was assuming that it was a mistranscription by ancestry, but that is what it says!

[kiterunner]

Baptism at St George in the East, 17 Oct 1806: John William, son of James Butcher, Mariner, by Maria, born at Langley Place, in Stepney Parish, the 13th September 1805.

And another baptism at St George in the East 27 Apr 1810 Charles, son of James Butcher, Mariner, by Maria, Gloucester Street, Commercial Road, born 8th March 1810.

Does this fit in with Miram's burial or does it prove this is a different couple?

Never mind, there is a James Butcher / Maria Hutton marriage at St George in the East in 1802, so we can forget about those 2 baptisms.

[Sue from Southend]

This won't really help at the moment but I found a weird baptism entry which could be James:
http://interactive.ancestry.co.uk/1624/31281_A101161-00005/5518819?backurl=http%3a%2f%2fsearch.ancestry.co.uk %2fcgi-bin%2fsse.dll%3fdb%3dlmaearlyparish%26so%3d2%26pca t%3d34%26gss%3dangs-c%26new%3d1%26rank%3d1%26msT%3d1%26gsfn%3djohn%2bi s*c*%26gsfn_x%3d1%26gsln%3dbutch*r*%26gsln_x%3d1%2 6mswpn__ftp_x%3d1%26MSAV%3d2%26MS_AdvCB%3d1%26gskw _x%3d1%26_83004002_x%3d1%26cpxt%3d1%26cp%3d11%26ca tbucket%3drstp&backlabel=ReturnSearchResults

22 Jul 1764 at St Botolph, Aldersgate, City of London: James s of John & Isaac Butcher. Before I clicked to view the image, I was assuming that it was a mistranscription by ancestry, but that is what it says!

Very modern :eek:

Thanks for looking Kite. Do you know whether FMP have all the Docklands Ancestors baptisms database? Docklands Ancestors itself seems to have gone subscription only - I'm sure you used to be able to do a free search using given name and surname and then pay for just one result.... I'm asking because the Wapping registers on Ancestry for 1790 -1810 seem to be burials only, no baptisms.

[kiterunner]

A John Butcher was buried at St Mary, Whitechapel, 3 Feb 1808, age 1, abode Workhouse, cause of death teething. Could be John Isaac?

Then Miram Butcher's burial 14 Nov 1810, abode Workhouse, age 47, cause of death decline.

A James Butcher was buried 27 Aug 1811, age 47, abode Church Lane, cause of death decline.

I wonder whether we can find any of these people in the workhouse records?

[kiterunner]

Thanks for looking Kite. Do you know whether FMP have all the Docklands Ancestors baptisms database? Docklands Ancestors itself seems to have gone subscription only - I'm sure you used to be able to do a free search using given name and surname and then pay for just one result.... I'm asking because the Wapping registers on Ancestry for 1790 -1810 seem to be burials only, no baptisms.

I don't know, sorry. But FMP have got St John, Wapping, baptisms included in the London, Docklands, and East End Baptisms database and it looks as though it includes all of that date range, though I didn't actually check each year separately. But the only Butcher there in that date range is an Elizabeth Martha, 1798, daughter of James and Ann. They do list an Elizabeth Butler 1 Mar 1795, born 25 May 1794, parents James and Miriam of Parson Street, wool comber.

[Sue from Southend]

I hadn't seen John's/James' possible burials both are possible. I have looked for Miriam and James in the Workhouse records but Whitechapel records that early aren't on line yet. Unless you can prove me wrong!

Just seen your post re FMP etc thanks the info - I don't think I'll be getting a sub for Docklands Ancestors as yet. But the Elizabeth BUTLER baptism looks interesting...

[kiterunner]

I hadn't seen John's/James' possible burials both are possible. I have looked for Miriam and James in the Workhouse records but Whitechapel records that early aren't on line yet. Unless you can prove me wrong!



I've just been looking but couldn't find Whitechapel records either.

[Sue from Southend]

I've found a possible birth for Miram, 11th March, St Botolph, Aldgate to a JOSEPH and Elizabeth Chesney. Not quite Chessen as per the marriage record but possible? There's also a burial in 1766 at the same church of a Miram Chesney, a "woman" - Joseph's mother perhaps.

But I'm getting ahead of myself again especially as I still can't find a connection to my Joseph Butcher.