Edward in 1861?

[Margaret in Burton]

I have Edward Allard in 1871 with his parents Alfred and Frances. Aged 13 and born in Burton.

I don't believe he was born an Allard as his 'father' Alfred is single and living with his mother in 1861.

Alfred Allard married Frances Warren in 1863 at St James, Barton under Needwood, which is a village just outside Burton. (StaffsBMD)

I can't find a birth reg for Edward under Allard or Warren neither can I find him or Frances in 1861.

1871 gives Alfred Allard aged 38 born Burton
Frances aged 38, born Burton
Edward aged 13 born Burton, plus other children.

RG10; Piece: 2904; Folio: 71; Page: 6

1861 gives Alfred aged 28 with his mother, also a 3 year old Frederick.

RG 9; Piece: 1965; Folio: 74; Page: 25

So, unless Frederick is Edward?

There is another Edward Allard born 1860. This isn't him.

[kiterunner]

Frances is in Eckington, Derbyshire, in 1861, unmarried servant:
1861 census ancestry (http://interactive.ancestry.co.uk/8767/DBYRG9_2534_2535-0065/22473480?backurl=http%3a%2f%2fsearch.ancestry.co.u k%2fcgi-bin%2fsse.dll%3fMS_AdvCB%3d1%26db%3duki1861%26rank %3d1%26new%3d1%26MSAV%3d2%26msT%3d1%26gss%3dangs-d%26gsfn%3df*an*%26gsfn_x%3dXO%26gsln%3dwar*n%26gs ln_x%3dXO%26msbdy%3d1833%26msbdy_x%3d1%26dbOnly%3d _F0005DFB%257c_F0005DFB_x%252c_F0005DFC%257c_F0005 DFC_x%252c_F0007B87%257c_F0007B87_x%252c_F0007B88% 257c_F0007B88_x%252c_F000597C%257c_F000597C_x%252c _83004006%257c_83004006_x%252c_F0005DFD%257c_F0005 DFD_x%252c_F0007989%257c_F0007989_x%26uidh%3dvm5%2 6msbdp%3d5%26_83004003-n_xcl%3dm%26gl%3d%26gst%3d%26hc%3d10%26fh%3d20%26f sk%3dBEDmZmYIgAAiPwEE1zA-61-&ssrc=&backlabel=ReturnSearchResults)

[kiterunner]

Hmm, Alfred seems to be called Fredrick in 1841:
1841 census ancestry (http://interactive.ancestry.co.uk/8978/STSHO107_975_976-0015/13697337?backurl=http%3a%2f%2fsearch.ancestry.co.u k%2fcgi-bin%2fsse.dll%3fMS_AdvCB%3d1%26db%3duki1841%26rank %3d1%26new%3d1%26so%3d3%26MSAV%3d2%26msT%3d1%26gss %3dms_r_db%26gsfn%3ddav*%26gsfn_x%3dXO%26gsln%3dal *rd%26gsln_x%3dXO%26dbOnly%3d_F000391C%257c_F00039 1C_x%26dbOnly%3d_F0003039%257c_F0003039_x%26dbOnly %3d_F000303A%257c_F000303A_x%26dbOnly%3d_F00032DB% 257c_F00032DB_x%26dbOnly%3d_F0002996%257c_F0002996 _x%26dbOnly%3d_F000303D%257c_F000303D_x%26dbOnly%3 d_F000303E%257c_F000303E_x%26uidh%3dvm5&ssrc=&backlabel=ReturnSearchResults)

[Margaret in Burton]

Thank you. Looks like Edward could be Frederick then and Arthur his father. I still can't see a birth reg.

[kiterunner]

Thank you. Looks like Edward could be Frederick then and Arthur his father. I still can't see a birth reg.

Do you mean Alfred, Marg?

I can't see a birth reg for Edward either but if his mother wasn't Frances, and he was registered under his mother's surname, we don't know what name to look for.

[Margaret in Burton]

Do you mean Alfred, Marg?

I can't see a birth reg for Edward either but if his mother wasn't Frances, and he was registered under his mother's surname, we don't know what name to look for.

Yes I do, sorry. I was rushing off out.

Yes, you're right.

[Margaret in Burton]

Hmm, Alfred seems to be called Fredrick in 1841:
1841 census ancestry (http://interactive.ancestry.co.uk/8978/STSHO107_975_976-0015/13697337?backurl=http%3a%2f%2fsearch.ancestry.co.u k%2fcgi-bin%2fsse.dll%3fMS_AdvCB%3d1%26db%3duki1841%26rank %3d1%26new%3d1%26so%3d3%26MSAV%3d2%26msT%3d1%26gss %3dms_r_db%26gsfn%3ddav*%26gsfn_x%3dXO%26gsln%3dal *rd%26gsln_x%3dXO%26dbOnly%3d_F000391C%257c_F00039 1C_x%26dbOnly%3d_F0003039%257c_F0003039_x%26dbOnly %3d_F000303A%257c_F000303A_x%26dbOnly%3d_F00032DB% 257c_F00032DB_x%26dbOnly%3d_F0002996%257c_F0002996 _x%26dbOnly%3d_F000303D%257c_F000303D_x%26dbOnly%3 d_F000303E%257c_F000303E_x%26uidh%3dvm5&ssrc=&backlabel=ReturnSearchResults)

Yes, I spotted that.

[Phoenix]

The only Fred I knew was, I thought, Frederick. So when someone asked for Alfred, I denied all knowledge.

If Dad were Fred and son Eddy, an enumerator might lose his head.

btw, did Alfred have any sisters whose son he might have adopted? Children don't usually get taken into the father's family if the parents aren't married.

[kiterunner]

btw, did Alfred have any sisters whose son he might have adopted? Children don't usually get taken into the father's family if the parents aren't married.

There are a couple of boys in my OH's tree whose parents weren't married but are with the father and not the mother on the census, so it can happen.
Come to think of it, I know that my grandfather's half-sister came to live with his parents (i.e. her father and stepmother) after her mother died, and she was also illegitimate.

[Margaret in Burton]

The only Fred I knew was, I thought, Frederick. So when someone asked for Alfred, I denied all knowledge.

If Dad were Fred and son Eddy, an enumerator might lose his head.

btw, did Alfred have any sisters whose son he might have adopted? Children don't usually get taken into the father's family if the parents aren't married.


Not that I've found