Lost in 1881 and 1911

[Just Gillian]

Charles Edward Taylor. Born Birmingham c1858 (baptism Sep 1858).

1871 with parents

http://interactive.ancestry.co.uk/7619/WARRG10_3081_3083-0173/2776254?backurl=http%3a%2f%2fsearch.ancestry.co.uk %2fcgi-bin%2fsse.dll%3fdb%3duki1871%26h%3d2776254%26ti%3d 5538%26indiv%3dtry%26gss%3dpt%26ssrc%3dpt_t6848634 6_p42182285158_kpidz0q3d42182285158z0q26pgz0q3d327 68z0q26pgplz0q3dpid&ssrc=pt_t68486346_p42182285158_kpidz0q3d4218228515 8z0q26pgz0q3d32768z0q26pgplz0q3dpid&backlabel=ReturnRecord

1891 with widowed mother

http://interactive.ancestry.co.uk/6598/WARRG12_2355_2357-0478/17000046?backurl=http%3a%2f%2fsearch.ancestry.co.u k%2fcgi-bin%2fsse.dll%3fdb%3duki1891%26h%3d17000046%26ti%3 d5538%26indiv%3dtry%26gss%3dpt%26ssrc%3dpt_t684863 46_p42182285158_kpidz0q3d42182285158z0q26pgz0q3d32 768z0q26pgplz0q3dpid&ssrc=pt_t68486346_p42182285158_kpidz0q3d4218228515 8z0q26pgz0q3d32768z0q26pgplz0q3dpid&backlabel=ReturnRecord

1901 with wife and daughter

http://interactive.ancestry.co.uk/7814/WORRG13_2815_2816-0511/16060091?backurl=http%3a%2f%2fsearch.ancestry.co.u k%2fcgi-bin%2fsse.dll%3fdb%3duki1901%26h%3d16060091%26ti%3 d5538%26indiv%3dtry%26gss%3dpt%26ssrc%3dpt_t684863 46_p42182285158_kpidz0q3d42182285158z0q26pgz0q3d32 768z0q26pgplz0q3dpid&ssrc=pt_t68486346_p42182285158_kpidz0q3d4218228515 8z0q26pgz0q3d32768z0q26pgplz0q3dpid&backlabel=ReturnRecord

1911 wife Ada Catherine is with her father in Birmingham

http://interactive.ancestry.co.uk/2352/rg14_17867_0399_03/57973453?backurl=http%3a%2f%2fsearch.ancestry.co.u k%2fcgi-bin%2fsse.dll%3fdb%3d1911England%26h%3d57973453%26 ti%3d5538%26indiv%3dtry%26gss%3dpt%26ssrc%3dpt_t68 486346_p42182285127_kpidz0q3d42182285127z0q26pgz0q 3d32768z0q26pgplz0q3dpid&ssrc=pt_t68486346_p42182285127_kpidz0q3d4218228512 7z0q26pgz0q3d32768z0q26pgplz0q3dpid&backlabel=ReturnRecord

He died 28th August 1915. Address 27 Guilford Street, Russell Square/Holborn (from Probate and burial, I have not seen death cert) and was returned to Birmingham for burial.

http://interactive.ancestry.co.uk/1904/31874_222523-00018/848156?backurl=http%3a%2f%2fsearch.ancestry.co.uk% 2fcgi-bin%2fsse.dll%3fdb%3dUKProbateCal%26h%3d848156%26t i%3d5538%26indiv%3dtry%26gss%3dpt%26ssrc%3dpt_t684 86346_p42182285158_kpidz0q3d42182285158z0q26pgz0q3 d32768z0q26pgplz0q3dpid&ssrc=pt_t68486346_p42182285158_kpidz0q3d4218228515 8z0q26pgz0q3d32768z0q26pgplz0q3dpid&backlabel=ReturnRecord

The family, on both sides, was fairly affluent, so I was surprised to see that his estate was only worth £15.00 and wondered what might have happened to the money. I have googled 27 Guilford Street, in case it was some kind of hospital, but haven't managed to discover anything.

I haven't found Charles in trade directories or on electoral rolls, in London or Birmingham, for the gap years.

I wondered if anyone might be able to find him in 1881 or 1911.

This is the groom in the double marriage thread I posted recently. I'll be adding to that thread later as friend has now received both certs. (Have to tame my bed hair first and put some clothes on just in case anyone braves the torrential rain to knock on my door!)

http://www.genealogistsforum.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=19822

[Uncle John]

I used to cross Guilford Street every day walking from St Pancras stn. to High Holborn. It runs at the back of Great Ormond Street hospital but the houses looked (from memory) like ordinary Victorian terraces. There was a lot of demolition and rebuilding going on there in the 1970s when I was commuting there.

[Just Gillian]

Thanks Uncle John. I had tried street view to get an idea of the properties but most of them appeared to be newish build, so it's good to know about the Victorian terraces.

[Phoenix]

As I don't do Ancestry, who are his parents, please?

[Just Gillian]

Thanks for looking Phoenix.

Samuel Taylor c1815 Birmingham and Helen (nee Bown) c1829 Stow on the Wold

[Phoenix]

Argh! I thought I found a William. Back to searching....

[Just Gillian]

lol Phoenix - I hadn't realised, until losing him last night, how popular a name Charles Taylor was. I had killed him off in 1901 and only started looking for him again in 1881 to "tidy up" my notes.

The rest of his family, including 10 siblings, were at 66 Pershore Road in 1881.

[Phoenix]

I am almost tempted to say that amongst all those siblings they just forgot him in 1881!

Do you ever wonder what those households were like with all those siblings growing older under their parents' roof? It makes me wonder what their personalties were like. (says someone who did just that!)

[Merry]

I looked at the 1881 census about two hours ago and found a Charles Taylor b Aston aged about 21 (from memory and perhaps a little young?!) who was recorded as Brother in the household to Henry who was a bit older. Could this be him? I see he had a brother Harry in 1871.

I didn't post it because I didn't see any connection in this Charles' occupation to yours, but I've just looked at the 1901 you listed above and see at that time he was something to do with brass founding and I'm sure that was similar to the 1881 I found! I don't remember what occ I thought he had! lol

Oh and also.....there was something odd about the other people in the house - a woman and child who were listed as some relationship to head that wasn't possible!

I can't do the lookup again as I'm on my phone which doesn't like Ancestry!

[kiterunner]

I looked at the 1881 census about two hours ago and found a Charles Taylor b Aston aged about 21 (from memory and perhaps a little young?!) who was recorded as Brother in the household to Henry who was a bit older. Could this be him? I see he had a brother Harry in 1871.

I didn't post it because I didn't see any connection in this Charles' occupation to yours, but I've just looked at the 1901 you listed above and see at that time he was something to do with brass founding and I'm sure that was similar to the 1881 I found! I don't remember what occ I thought he had! lol

Oh and also.....there was something odd about the other people in the house - a woman and child who were listed as some relationship to head that wasn't possible!

I can't do the lookup again as I'm on my phone which doesn't like Ancestry!

This is the entry you are talking about:
1881 census (http://interactive.ancestry.co.uk/7572/WARRG11_3016_3020-0322/22532252?backurl=http%3a%2f%2fsearch.ancestry.co.u k%2fcgi-bin%2fsse.dll%3fdb%3duki1881%26so%3d2%26pcat%3d188 1UKI%26MS_AdvCB%3d1%26rank%3d1%26new%3d1%26MSAV%3d 2%26msT%3d1%26gss%3dangs-c%26gsfn%3dcha*%26gsfn_x%3dXO%26gsln%3dta*l*r%26gs ln_x%3dXO%26msbdy%3d1860%26msbdy_x%3d1%26gskw%3das ton%26gskw_x%3d1%26uidh%3dvm5&ssrc=&backlabel=ReturnSearchResults)
9 Berkley Ter, Bedford Rd, Aston, Birmingham
Henry Taylor Head Unm 24 Brass Strip Caster Warwicksh Aston
Charles Do Brother Unm 21 Brass Tube Core Maker Do Do
-
Harriet Wagstaff Daur W 31 Do Greet
Charles Do Nephew 4 Do Aston

[Just Gillian]

I cannot imagine it!

And there was another boy who died somewhere between 2 and 13 years old. Poor woman - pregnant every couple of years and no servants after 1861!

The eldest two girls were still living with their mother, in their 50s, in 1911 - singing and music teachers. The third daughter, a school teacher, was, I think, in the city asylum in 1901.

[Just Gillian]

Thanks Merry and Kate.

Don't think that can be him - his brother Henry is still with parents in 1881 as Harry. He is a solicitor.

Charles was a manufacturing brass founder in 1901, an employer.

[Merry]

Bother! lol

[Merry]

Have you checked the Gazette for potential bankruptcy? (just thinking of the £15 estate)

[Just Gillian]

Yes, I tried The Gazette last night.

If there was no bankruptcy, other options for the low value of the estate seemed to be that he had been ill or he had run off with another woman and blown his funds. However, there was no will so presumably he hadn't been anticipating death, and, if he had deserted his wife, she would have been unlikely to bring him to Birmingham for a funeral (assuming it was she who arranged it).

[Merry]

In 1911 Ada said she had been married 16 years with one child born, still living.

There's a Charles Taylor, boarder, aged 50, born Birmingham, living in Fulham who is an estate agent. He filled in the boxes for married women (!) saying he had been married 15 years with one child born, still living.


Charles Taylor 1911? (http://interactive.ancestry.co.uk/2352/rg14_00254_0399_03/4222?backurl=http%3a%2f%2fsearch.ancestry.co.uk%2f cgi-bin%2fsse.dll%3fdb%3d1911england%26so%3d2%26pcat%3 dROOT_CATEGORY%26MS_AdvCB%3d1%26rank%3d1%26new%3d1 %26MSAV%3d2%26msT%3d1%26gss%3dangs-g%26gsfn%3dcharles%26gsfn_x%3dXO%26gsln%3dtaylor%2 6gsln_x%3dXO%26msydy%3d1861%26msydy_x%3d1%26gskw%3 dfulham%26gskw_x%3d1%26cpxt%3d1%26catBucket%3drt%2 6uidh%3d672%26cp%3d11&ssrc=&backlabel=ReturnSearchResults)

Possible?

[kiterunner]

In the London electoral register for 1914 and 1915, no 27 Guilford Street, Holborn, is occupied by a Mrs Emalie J McOstrich (landlady) and a Henry Nowell Harvey (renting a room).

[kiterunner]

Well done, Merry!

[Just Gillian]

Sorry - phone went just as I was reading your replies an hour ago!

Brilliant! That has to be him Merry - thank you!

Interestingly, 15 years fits with the couple's 2nd marriage too.

It's very different, and far less methodical, helping someone else with their tree, so I'm struggling to remember which line did what, but there was certainly a lot of involvement in building societies, land agencies etc amongst them all.

Thanks Kate! I've no idea how you did that. The landlady/boarder entry rules out the possibility of illness/hospital then. Don't suppose the death cert would answer any of the questions about why he was living apart from his wife unfortunately.

I have never in my life come across the name McOstrich!

[Just Gillian]

As requested by my friend, I am passing on her thanks to all who tried to find Charles Edward in 1881 and 1911. She is thrilled by your 1911 find Merry and the electoral roll details about 27 Guilford St Kate! She has now sent for the death cert.

She was amazed that people on here would go to so much trouble for others. I told her that is one of the nice aspects of the genealogy community - and this community in particular.

So let's hear it for GF!!

*claps enthusiastically*