Your help and opinions please

[Margaret in Burton]

I've been attempting the Lincs to the Past site and have come across a Robert Dawes transported to New South Wales.

Reference Name Convict 489

Name: Dawes Robert of Claypole ( have no idea how that Smilie got in there and I can't get rid of it. It should be Dawes.

Age:30/36

Crime:Stealing 12 bushels of wheat, the property of William Loughton; stealing 8 tame fowls, the property of [ ] Lunn; and 4 other charges at the same sessions

Place of Crime:Claypole

Court:Kesteven Quarter Sessions

Trial Date:03/07/1834

Sentence:14 Years

Ship:Westmoreland

Destination:New South Wales

Transportation Date:1835

Notes:Married with 1 child. He was described as having a "very bad" character, unable to read or write, and being in a good state of health. Convicted with William Emmons, John Scholey and Robert Wordsworth

Repository: Lincolnshire Archives [057]

I do have a Robert Dawes son of William and Elizabeth baptised 1802 in Claypole.

Free Reg have 2 children baptised to Robert Dawes and Jane in Claypole.
Mary 17 Sep 1832 and Elizabeth Jane 12 Oct 1834.

If these two Roberts are the same person then the transportation document says he has one child. I assume one died or his wife was pregnant at the time of the trial.

[Margaret in Burton]

Just found this on FMP


Convict departures to New South Wales 1788-1842


State: New South Wales
Country: Australia
Day of arrival in NSW: 15
Month of arrival in NSW: Jul
Year of arrival in NSW: 1835
Given names: ROBERT
Surname: DAWES
Ship name: WESTMORELAND
Record source: Convict Arrivals in New South Wales
Data provider: The Genealogical Society of Victoria

[ElizabethHerts]

Marg, as you have FMP you should be able to see this, which has some detail:

http://www.findmypast.co.uk/records/newspapers/view/BL/0000237/18340711/005/0002?&firstName=Robert&lastName=Dawes&county=Lincolnshire%2C+England&keywords=&fromYear=1830&toYear=1837&includeVariants=true&pageNumber=1

It mentions Robert Dawes' wife Jane.

[Margaret in Burton]

That just gives me the FMP Homepage Elizabeth

[ElizabethHerts]

Search the newspapers - I put in "Robert Dawes" and a year span of "1830 to 1837" and clicked on Lincolnshire for the county. Or you could enter "Claypole". It was the only hit.

[Margaret in Burton]

The link worked the second time. Does look like to be him doesn't it.

[Margaret in Burton]

I really need to find the marriage of Robert and Jane now I suppose.

[kiterunner]

I've removed the smiley for you, Marg. It was caused by the lack of a space between the : and the D.

[kiterunner]

FamilySearch has a marriage between a Robert Daws and a Jane Jessop 8 Dec 1831 at Long Bennington, Lincolnshire, but they also have a baptism of a Robert Jessop Dowse 10 Sep 1837 at Kirton in Holland, Lincolnshire, parents Robert Dowse and Jane. The birth is registered Jul-Sep 1837 so it isn't a case of him being conceived just before Robert Dawes was transported in 1835.

[kiterunner]

The NSW convict musters for 1837 show Robert Dawes age 32. Then he is listed in the Tasmania pardons for 1841-2, under regulations of May 1835. (These are both definitely the same Robert as it shows ship name and place and date of trial.)

[Margaret in Burton]

FamilySearch has a marriage between a Robert Daws and a Jane Jessop 8 Dec 1831 at Long Bennington, Lincolnshire, but they also have a baptism of a Robert Jessop Dowse 10 Sep 1837 at Kirton in Holland, Lincolnshire, parents Robert Dowse and Jane. The birth is registered Jul-Sep 1837 so it isn't a case of him being conceived just before Robert Dawes was transported in 1835.

I remember seeing that marriage and discounting it for some reason. The Daws family did end up in Long Bennington. Robert's brother John, my 3 x great grandfather had his children in Long Bennington .

[Margaret in Burton]

The NSW convict musters for 1837 show Robert Dawes age 32. Then he is listed in the Tasmania pardons for 1841-2, under regulations of May 1835. (These are both definitely the same Robert as it shows ship name and place and date of trial.)

Where did you find this Kate?

[kiterunner]

And some info from the NSW Convict Indents (also from ancestry):
Dawes Robert age 33 religion Prot Married 1 child native place Lincolnshire, trade Farm Servant Shepherd, offence Stealing Grain, when tried Lincoln 8 Kul 1834 sentence 14 yrs, former convictions none, height 5' 5 1/2, complexion sallow, hair brown, eyes hazel, lost left canine tooth of upper. Fair ????? a little hairy scar left side of neck. Carroty whiskers. Scar back of right forefinger. Scar ball of left thumb. Scar back of left forefinger.

[kiterunner]

Where did you find this Kate?
Sorry, I should have said from ancestry.

[kiterunner]

Oh, that's weird - FreeREG has a marriage of a Robert Dowse and Jane Jessop 12 May 1836 at Kirton in Holland, so that 1837 birth of Robert Jessop Dowse doesn't rule out the 1831 Robert Daws / Jane Jessop marriage as your couple.

[kiterunner]

Ancestry has his Ticket of Leave, from NSW, so I wonder whether that convict pardon listed under Tasmania was supposed to be NSW too?

Ticket of Leave No 41/1783 9 Sep 1841
Prisoner's No 35/1668
Name Robert Dawes
Ship Westmoreland
Master Brigstock
Year 1835
Place of Trial Lincoln (Western)
Date of Trial 3 Jul 1834
Sentence Fourteen years
Allowed to remain in the District of Bathurst
Dated May 1841

[Margaret in Burton]

Thanks Kate

[Margaret in Burton]

Just looking again at this.

I've found Jane on the 1841 census with the two children living with a William Blundy.

http://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bin/sse.dll?indiv=1&rank=0&gsfn=jane&gsln=daw*s&sx=&f1=Lincolnshire&f2=&f3=&f18=&rg_81004011__date=&rs_81004011__date=0&_82004011=&_82004013=&f7=&f20=&f8=&f9=&gskw=claypole&prox=1&db=uki1841&ti=5538&ti.si=0&gss=angs-d&pcat=35&fh=0&h=6615161&recoff=31+33

1851 too, says she's born in Benington, which is a different place to Long Bennington but she does say Long Bennington in 1861.

Can't find a marriage to William Blundy though, would she be allowed to remarry if her husband had been transported?

[kiterunner]

Yes, I believe they were allowed to remarry a certain number of years later.

[Margaret in Burton]

Yes, I believe they were allowed to remarry a certain number of years later.

Can't find a marriage though so presume they didn't bother.

[Anstey Nomad]

You were never able to re-marry if your spouse was transported...unless they were known to be dead or had not been heard of for long enough for there to be a legal presumption of death, which means a court order and expense (think Richey Edwards)

However, plenty married bigamously in those circumstances or, as Marg suggests here, just didn't bother.

AN

[HarrysMum]

My brain is still mush this time of morning....lol

Do you have possible parents for Robert?

[kiterunner]

You were never able to re-marry if your spouse was transported...unless they were known to be dead or had not been heard of for long enough for there to be a legal presumption of death, which means a court order and expense (think Richey Edwards)

However, plenty married bigamously in those circumstances or, as Marg suggests here, just didn't bother.

AN



There is some information in this book (hope this link works):
Google Books (http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=C2p_Pe_IzycC&pg=PA30&lpg=PA30&dq=after+transportation+spouse+could+remarry+seven +years&source=bl&ots=TrQPHZ6xdT&sig=KoslrPW6GOJodHmliPpDERLoF1w&hl=en&sa=X&ei=VQPOUfiiIcjJOa2sgegI&ved=0CDYQ6AEwAQ#v=onepage&q=after%20transportation%20spouse%20could%20remarr y%20seven%20years&f=false)

[Margaret in Burton]

My brain is still mush this time of morning....lol

Do you have possible parents for Robert?

William Daw(e)s and Elizabeth Clarke Libby

[HarrysMum]

The two Robert Dawes deaths in NSW have Robert and Richard as fathers. The Richard one has Jane as his mother. The other has no mother.

[Margaret in Burton]

The two Robert Dawes deaths in NSW have Robert and Richard as fathers. The Richard one has Jane as his mother. The other has no mother.

Thanks Libby. He perhaps moved away from NSW then.

[HarrysMum]

Blow!!!!

Just found a death for Robert Dawe, son of William and Elizabeth in Qld, but it's 1918.

[tenterfieldjulie]

Sorry I haven't looked at this before Marg. I have been sleuthing my OH's O'Connor's.
I'll have a look and see if I can make any suggestions that are only available in NSW. Julie
Oh I'd better have something to eat first. I will return. Julie

[Margaret in Burton]

Been away for a couple of days so only just seen that Libby and Julie are still digging at this.

He'd have been a very old man if he died in 1918, lol

[Olde Crone]

Re posts #21 and #23 above.

Somewhere I have, or I have certainly seen, a church marriage certificate where the bride is remarried "with the permission of the Arch bishop, her previous husband having been sent beyond the seas for life".

OC

[tenterfieldjulie]

Marg, I really haven't looked properly into your Robert Dawes, but somewhere in the back of my mind I believe that there was a book written on the "Westmoreland" and the convicts that came out on it. I am not sure whether there were a number of voyages, but you might find something if you Google it.. Julie

[tenterfieldjulie]

I found this but there isn't a lot for 1835 it is mostly 1838

Archives Kit Reel [2/8282]

Westmoreland (1) 1835 p.59
Westmoreland (3) 1838 p.75 Memorandum on the families of convicts recommended to be sent to NSW;
List of sons of convicts embarked;
List of military convicts;
Chief Justice's Warrants for Military convicts; and Manifests of Convict Stores laden on board at the Ports of Liverpool and Dublin – showing shippers, packages, quantity, goods, remarks

I'm not sure if what is on the reel will be what you already have from Ancestry? Julie

[tenterfieldjulie]

Marg I am not sure of the relevance, or whether it has been posted, but I found in the NSW Register of Coroner's Inquest at Tambaroora on 21 Dec 1858 that a Robert Dawes was accidentally drowned. This is just prior to Christmas, at a very hot time of year and sadly this is quite a common occurrence. Julie
Often times deaths recorded in Coroner's Inquests are not recorded on the BDM index.

[HarrysMum]

Sounds good Julie. Tambaroora is just up the road from Bathurst.


OC...I have seen that on a record somewhere as well. I think it had something to do with the idea that the spouse was not likely to return.

I'll have to have a look.

[tenterfieldjulie]

Well as he was in Bathurst in 1841, it is quite possibly him drowning at Tambaroora in 1858. I wonder if anything from the Coroner's Inquest survived, apart from the index. I know with early inquest reports a lot survived, but there are some black holes. The reports are on the reels of the archives kit, but whether they are also on Ancestry I'm not sure? I looked at a ship's captain who died from laudanum poisoning and they were trying to decide whether it was an accident or suicide. Laudanum was often used in those days as pain relief. Julie

[tenterfieldjulie]

I tried looking on Trove at the Bathurst newspapers unfortunately it goes from the 22nd December the day after to 25th December. There are only 4 pages to each issue and it is very tiny print so at a later date I will have another look. I did think the following item put what happened into perspective;( ..

Bathurst Free Press and Mining Journal (NSW : 1851 - 1904)
Wednesday 22 December 1858
IMPROVEMENT IN THE WEATHER -- Since our last report there has been a decided improvement in the weather. Sunday and Monday kept the world in alarm with a continued series of thunder storms accompanied with showers of rain. Yesterday (Tuesday) however, broke upon the world with a clear sky and gave us that rare pleasure, of late, a day's sunshine. As the ground is now abundantly moist, and the wheat harvest approaching, a few weeks' fine weather would prove a great blessing.

Not only was it hot, but obviously had been steamy and the rivers running a banker, after a lot of rain.

[HarrysMum]

Julie....I can only find the same you did on Ancestry.

[tenterfieldjulie]

Yes I will try to get to the library some time today and look at the reel.