View Full Version : Wonderful find, but now need a look up please
Lynn the Forest Fan
30-05-13, 07:30
Earlier this week, I discovered a newspaper article which included photos of 5 of my gg uncles! The family come from Barton upon Humber in Lincolnshire and I have a contact (from the Great war forum) who has done lots of research on the people of the town in the war. He had just created a Facebook page about his work & had put up the pictures (https://www.facebook.com/?ref=tn_tnmn#!/groups/470728806338740/) My family is the Barleys and I was aware that 2 of the sons were killed during the war (John Edward and William Herbert) and that the eldest (Alfred Henry)had enlisted but had not served abroad due to being unfit. This new article gave me not only photos but also the information that 2 other brothers (Fred & Robert) had also served. Fred was in the RNR and I have found (but not yet bought) documents relating to him on TNA site. Robert is the one I would appreciate a look up for. I had always thought he had served, but had looked for him serving in a Lincs regiment like his brothers. I had found 1 Robert in the Lincs but he came from elsewhere and had discounted another in the Gordon Highlanders, but this turns out to be him!
I don't currently have an Ancestry sub & would really appreciate it if sks could get his medal card & any service records for me please.
Robert Barley born 1880 Barton upon Humber 1st Gordon Highlanders 3/7070 Private. 2nd Highland Light Infantry 352642 Private.
Many thanks
Lynn, I've got heaps of stuff on the Barley family of Barton - plus pics of the war memorials, etc. I'll dig it out for you.
Lynn the Forest Fan
30-05-13, 07:45
Thanks Shona :)
There aren't any surviving service or pension records for your Robert as far as I know.
The medal record card states that he received the Victory, British and 1914 Star - he entered a theatre of war on 8 Nov 1914.
The card indicates that the medals were returned at some point for adjustment.
There is a Roll of Honour in St Mary's Church in Barton. The following Barley names are listed:
Fred
John
John Edward
Robert
William Herbert
I think that John and John Edward are one of the same and a duplicate was added to the Roll of Honour.
John Edward Barley was a trimmer on the Blackwhale and died on 3 Jan 1918 - I have lots of info on this.
William Herbert Barley was a Lance Corporal in the Lincolnshire Regiment and was one of the 17 Barton men who died as a result of the attack on the Hohenzollern Redoubt (part of the Battle of Loos) on 13 October 1915.
Robert Barley was the son of Edward Chapman Barley and his wife, Septiana nee Anderton. In 1891, the family lived at 1 Victoria Terrace, Gashouse Lane, Barton.
Edward and Septiana had 13 children - 11 were still alive at the time of the 1911 census.
1891
Edward C Barley, 54, mariner (chief)
Septiana Barley, 47
John Edward Barley, 17, mariner
Fred Barley, 16, brickyard labourer
George Barley, 14, wheel turner for twine spinner
Bertha Barley, 13
Robert Barley, 10
William Herbert Barley, 8
Rhoda Barley, 6
Annie Barley, 3
The family were still living in Gashouse Lane in 1901. Edward described himself as a sloopman and claimed to be 59, while Septiana was 57.
Edward C Barley, 54, sloopman, seas
Septiana Barley, 57
Edward Barley, 30, cement maker
Fred Barley, 26, sailor, steamship
Robert barley, 21, sloopman
William Barley, 18, brickmaker
Rhoda Barley, 16
Annie Barley, 13
Septiana Barley died at the age of 71 in Hull in 1915. Edward died in 1918.
1911
22 Dam Road, Barton
Edward, 75, old age pensioner
Septiana, 67
Alfred, 48, sloopman
George, 33, keelman
Robert, 30, keelman
William Herbert, 30, labourer at chemical works
Edward Stamp, 5, grandson
Edward and Septiana had been married for 48 years.
BTW - all of the Barley family mentioned so far were born in Barton.
JOHN EDWARD BARLEY
Trimmer 1018TS, Royal Naval Reserve, HM Whaler Blackwhale
Died: 3 January 1918, aged 46 years
Born in Barton-upon-Humber
Son of Edward and Septiana Barley
Husband of Kate Barley, 21 Dam Road, Barton-upon-Humber
Commemorated: Chatham Naval Memorial, Kent
Commemorated:
Barton War Memorial – J.E. Barley
St Andrew’s Church, Immingham – John E Barley
St Mary’s roll of honour – John E. Barley
St Peter’s Church – John E. Barley – date of death, 4 January
Trinity Methodist Memorial – John E. Barley
Background
John Edward Barley was born in Barton-upon-Humber on 2 August 1873, son of Edward Chapman Barley and Septiana (nee Anderton) Barley, who was born in 1844.
In 1891, the Barley family lived at 1 Victoria Terrace, Gashouse Lane, in Barton. All of the family were born in Barton. Aged 55, John’s father, Edward, was a chief mariner. Gashouse Lane was a former name of Dam Road. In 1846 the Barton Gas Works were built on the lane.
At the time of the census, John and Septiana had eight children living at home:
- John Edward, 17 (mariner)
- Fred, 16 (brickyard labourer)
- George, 14 (wheel turner for twine spinner)
- Bertha, 13
- Robert, 10
- William Herbert, eight
- Rhoda, six
- Annie, three
The family still lived in Gashouse Lane when the next census was conducted in 1901. Edward Barley described himself as a sloopman, and claimed to be 59, while Septiana was recorded as being 57.
In 1901, Edward junior (30) worked as a cement maker, Robert (21), was a sloopman like his father and 18-year-old William was a brickmaker. Rhoda (16) and Annie (13) still lived at home. Fred, 26, was a steamship sailor.
John Barley married Kate Hedley in Hull in 1901. She was born in Barton in June 1868 to George and Mary Hedley.
In 1911, John (37) and Kate (42) lived at 10 Victoria Terrace in Barton two children – eight-year-old Annie Septiana (born in 1902) and Herbert, five.
John’s parents Edward and Septiana lived nearby in Dam Road. The couple had been married for 48 years and had 11 surviving children (two had died in infancy). Edward was an old age pensioner. The Pensions Act was passed by Parliament in 1908 and the first payments were made on 1 January 1909 to people over 70 who passed a series of means tests.
Living with Edward and Septiana were Alfred (48), a sloopman, George (33) a keelman, Robert (30) also a keelman, William Herbert (28), a chemical works labourer and grandson, Edward Stamp (aged five).
John and three of his brothers – Fred, Robert and William – served in the war.
Robert Barley was wounded in action. The 12 June xxxxx (CHECK!!!) edition of the Lincolnshire Star reported:
WOUNDED. – Information was received
on Sunday morning that Private Robert
Barley, of the Gordon Highlanders, is in
hospital wounded. This is the second time
Barley has been wounded during the
campaign.
Later in 1915, news reached the Barley family that Lance Corporal William Barley, who was serving with the 5th Battalion Lincolnshire Regiment, had been killed in action on 13 October 1915 – one of the 17 Barton men who lost their lives as a result of the assault on the Hohenzollern Redoubt. Septiana Barley died in Hull late in 1915. She was 71.
On New Year’s Day 1918, Trimmer John Barley and fellow Barton resident, Deck Hand Tom Kirk, set out with the Blackwhale for her regular escort duties along the east coast of Britain. At 3.45am on 3 January, she struck a mine forcing the crew to abandon ship. John Barley (aged 46) and Tom Kirk (aged 29) were among the 12 who lost their lives. John’s wife, Kate, was living at 21 Dam Road when she heard of her husband’s fate.
John’s father, Edward Barley, having lost two sons in the war, and his wife, died early in 1918 in Barton-upon-Humber. John’s brothers, Fred and Robert, both survived the war. All four brothers are listed on the St Mary’s church roll of honour.
John and Kate Barley’s daughter, Annie Septiana Barley, married Frank Hector Eastoe in 1924.
The sinking of the Blackwhale
HM Whaler Blackwhale was ordered on 15 March 1915 and built by Smiths Dock Co using designs prepared for the Russian Government. She was launched 28 June 1915.
As the Blackwhale and other vessels of her type (there a further 14) were constructed to hunt whales, they were fast and responsive. Therefore, the Admiralty judged the Blackwhale to be ideal for anti-submarine escorts in coastal waters.
The whalers served in three squadrons. One based at Stornaway in the Hebrides, another based in the far north in the Shetland Islands. Blackwhale’s squadron conducted their escort work from the Humber north to Peterhead on the east coast of Scotland.
Blackwhale was part of an 11-strong escort to a Scandinavian convoy that sailed from the Humber on 1 January 1918. They were joined by more vessels off the Tyne – a total of 27 ships.
At 3.45am on 3 January 1918, while the convoy was off Fife Ness in Scotland, a dark object – a mine – was seen under the port bow of the Blackwhale. An explosion followed. Blackwhale signalled other ships in the convoy, but her message was misunderstood and several ships steamed past, unaware of what had happened. Finally, a signal flashed by a torch got the attention of the escort destroyers. The trawler Grosbeak closed in and attempted to tow the stricken Blackwhale. But there was too much damage. The ship suddenly sank, forcing the survivors of the explosion to jump into boats and a raft. Twelve men died in the incident – 10 in the explosion with two more perishing in the icy sea. John Barley and Tom Kirk’s bodies weren’t recovered.
Blackwhale’s position was 56.19N, 00.45W. The mine was likely one laid by UC49 in December 1917. U boats targetted the Firth of Forth, Fife, Scotland, because of the large number of vessels based in Rosyth dockyard.
The Blackwhale was commanded by Lieut James Kennedy RNR. Kennedy was one of the few survivors and was awarded a medal for ‘valuable services in command of HMW Blackwhale whilst acting as leader of Coastal Convoys’.
The crew who died were:
Thomas J Albert, L/Trimmer, RNR S T 363
John E Barley, Trimmer, RNR T S 1018
Albert Beresford, RNR E B 444
Henry Dalton, Trimmer, RNR S T 1463
Samuel H. Dungey, Trimmer RNR S T 2883
John F Enright, Trimmer, RNR T S 7176
Gordon W Gage, RNCVR V R 3255
Tom Kirk, Deckhand, RNR D A 15448
Henry Larvin, Trimmer, RNR T S 1388
James S Morris, Trimmer, RNR T S 6740
John F Sim, Trimmer, RNR S T 5800
Harry P Toulson, Trimmer, RNR S T 2258
Survivors:
Lieut James Kennedy
Deckhand, Jack Vince, RNCVR
Deckhand, Henry Huffman, RNCVR
WILLIAM HERBERT BARLEY
Lance Corporal 3161, 1st/5th Battalion Lincolnshire Regiment
Killed in action: 13 October 1915, aged 33 years
Born in Barton-upon-Humber
Brother of Robert Barley, 30 Dam Road, Barton-upon-Humber
Enlisted in Barton-upon-Humber
Commemorated: Loos Memorial
The Loos Memorial forms the sides and back of Dud Corner Cemetery and commemorates over 20,000 men who have no known grave and who died in the area from the River Lys to the old southern boundary of the First Army, east and west of Grenay.
Commemorated:
Barton War Memorial – W.H. Barley
St Mary’s roll of honour – William H Barley
St Peter’s Church – as William H. Barley
Trinity Methodist Church – as William H. Barley
Medals: Victory, British, 1915 Star.
Robert Barley of 8 High Street, Barton, died on 9 April 1953 in the Memorial Hospital in Scunthorpe.
Administration of his estate on 26 April 1954 at Lincoln granted to Annie Stead (wife of George Stead). Effects £324 4s 3d.
Annie is his sister - she married George Stead in 1910.
These are the war memorial panels in St Peter's Barton.
http://i1326.photobucket.com/albums/u654/shonamcisaac/BartonStPeters12_zps27ee2b0c.jpg (http://s1326.photobucket.com/user/shonamcisaac/media/BartonStPeters12_zps27ee2b0c.jpg.html)
http://i1326.photobucket.com/albums/u654/shonamcisaac/BartonStPeters22_zps31b801ac.jpg (http://s1326.photobucket.com/user/shonamcisaac/media/BartonStPeters22_zps31b801ac.jpg.html)
http://i1326.photobucket.com/albums/u654/shonamcisaac/BartonStPeters32_zpscbbc1227.jpg (http://s1326.photobucket.com/user/shonamcisaac/media/BartonStPeters32_zpscbbc1227.jpg.html)
The 4th panel.
http://i1326.photobucket.com/albums/u654/shonamcisaac/BartonStPeters4_zps534f4a5a.jpg (http://s1326.photobucket.com/user/shonamcisaac/media/BartonStPeters4_zps534f4a5a.jpg.html)
I'm wondering whether Robert was in the 1st Battalion of the regular forces or in the 1/6th of the Territorial forces.
Although the 1/6th arrived in Le Harve on 10 November 1914 (Robert's medal card says he arrived on 8 November), they recruited in the Banff area in Scotland. I wonder what took him there?
Here's a little bit about the 1/6th:
The 1/6th (Banffshire and Donside) Battalion, The Gordon Highlanders was a Territorial unit based at Keith with Gordon Brigade, Highland Division. When war broke out in August 1914 they had just departed for annual camp and were recalled at once to home base. They moved to Bedford and on the 10th of November 1914 they proceeded to France landing at Le Havre, and joined 20th Brigade, 7th Division. On the 5th of January 1916 they left 7th Division and moved to Lines of Communication. On the 1st June 1916 they joined 152nd Brigade, 51st (Highland) Division. they were in action in the Battles of the Somme, including the attacks on High Wood and The Battle of the Ancre, capturing Beaumont Hamel, taking more than 2000 prisoners. In 1917 They took part in the Arras Offensive, The Battle of Pilkem Ridge, The Battle of Menin Road Ridge and the Cambrai Operations. They remained in the Cambrai area until the 21st of March 1918, when the enemy launched an overwhelming attack and the Division were engaged in a fighting withdrawal back to Bapaume. In April they moved north and fought in The Battles of the Lys before a quiet spell at Oppy near Arras, from May to July. They were then in action at The Battle of the Tardenois, The Battle of the Scarpe, The pursuit to the Selle and the Final Advance in Picardy. On the 6th of October 1918 they amalgamated with 1/7th Gordons to form 6/7th Battalion. They were resting the Cambrai-Iwuy area at the Armistice and demobilisation began December.
Lynn the Forest Fan
30-05-13, 20:19
Wow Shona, that is amazing! I do have a lot of the information you have given but there is a lot of background stuff that I didn't have & I never had Robert's death. I don't think I have seen the pics of the St Peter's memorial either. Edward & Septiana told a little fib about how long they had been married, as it didn't happen until Oct 1908, just in time for the pensions! Septiana died the day after William Herbert died, whilst Edward died a few weeks after John
Thank you
Looking at some more notes - Septiana had her first child, Phoebe, when she was a teenager and before she got hitched to Edward.
If I could find them, I've also got pics of the Trinity Methodist Chapel memorial.
Lynn the Forest Fan
30-05-13, 21:02
Yes, many people list Pheobe as being Edward's but I don't think she was as she didn't name him on her marriage cert
Lynn the Forest Fan
30-05-13, 21:26
The Barleys are my grandmother's family, but George Stead, who married Annie Barley (mentioned above) was my grandad's 2nd cousin once removed.
I am really intriguged by how Robert came to be in a Scottish regiment.
Me, too. Robert was a Humber keel man, so you'd think he'd have joined the Navy or the Lincs like his brothers.
There were a couple of other Barton lads who served with Scottish regiments - perhaps they were friends or went to the same church?
Still looking for my orig transcription of the Lincolnshire Star which reported Robert had been wounded to check the year.
Lynn the Forest Fan
31-05-13, 06:18
Exactly Shona, which is why I had always discounted that one as being my Robert barley.
Margaret in Burton
31-05-13, 07:58
The Barleys are my grandmother's family, but George Stead, who married Annie Barley (mentioned above) was my grandad's 2nd cousin once removed.
I am really intriguged by how Robert came to be in a Scottish regiment.
My OH's great uncle served in the 1st Battalion Gordon Highlanders in WW1. He was Burton born and bred and neither one of us has any Scottish ancestry. He enlisted in the North Staffs and was turned down due to poor health. Unfortunately the Gordon's took him and he was killed in Flanders. I can only assume that regiments visited towns and recruited men.
Lynn the Forest Fan
31-05-13, 08:02
That would make sense Margaret.
I have managed to trace the newspaper that the article was from, via the BNA, it was in the Hull Daily Mail 14th September 1915, shame my credits on there have run out :(
George Stead also served in WW1.
Find My Past's newspaper archive has a report from the Hull Daily Mail dated 7 Nov 1914. At then end of the article about William Barker of Waterside Road, Barton, who had been killed on 1st September, it mentions Robert.
'Pte R Barley, Gordon Highlanders, well known at Barton, is now at the front.'
There is a pic of him in uniform.
Hope this works!
http://search.api.brightsolid.com/bl/v1/seadragon/download/h=411B3E9EAD69AE4E6FD66CA369F6661B933A9952648E39A9 8C459BE87B606197AA514B5F1F75D233DBFB449D355C94A70A 8765CC0A1A233BF66E3A3CA686217F/BL/0000324/19141107/0003/A4
There are five Barley men named on the St Mary's memorial as serving. I had always assumed that one of those was a duplicate entry. Seems I'm wrong.
Lynn, is this the Hull Daily Mail article you were reading?
http://search.api.brightsolid.com/bl/v1/seadragon/download/h=F50D88325314588B75B7C3488E7614E6F36087C384BF8F13 2D24B5AD1147724CA3E3BD72AE5D65F3493B621ABF4B7185E1 47F349EF842DDCD9905B88840D9CCA/BL/0000324/19150904/0002/A4
There were five who served...
Barton Illustrated
The above photographs are of five sons of Mr and Mrs Ed Barley now serving on land and sea. Fred and Jack are mine-sweeping, Robert (Gordon Highlander) has been twice wounded and is now in hospital in Eastbourne. Herbert 1/5th Lincolnshire is now at the front and Alfred 2/5th Lincolnshire is home on leave.
Lynn the Forest Fan
31-05-13, 10:52
Thank you so much Shona, that is fantastic! I think that the St Mary's memorial listed down a wrong name, although Alfred didn't see service abroad, he was 50 years old when the war began
The St Mary's Roll of Honour names all who served, whether they saw active service or not.
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