Service Records

[Olde Crone]

Something rather curious has happened and I would welcome any thoughts.

My friend sent for her (late) father's RAF records. Her parents were not married but his name and rank are on her BC. She asked if there was any information about a previous wife.

She had a phone call from someone at the MOD, who said that off the record, he could tell her that her father went to prison in 1929 for nonpayment of maintenance. He regretted he was unable to tell her any more. She then received a letter from the MOD, returning her cheque and saying that they were "unable" to supply the requested records. No reason was given.

Would you think, as I am thinking, that there must be a name of a first wife/children on his records and that is why they will not release his records? Can you think of any other reason, given that they have definitely found his records?

OC

[Phoenix]

That does seem reasonable, since the children of an earlier marriage might well be still alive AND they would be the next of kin, rather than your friend.

[annswabey]

I don't think they differentiate between who might be next of kin - it doesn't have to be the eldest child. Next of kin, as defined on their form, appears to be 1 Spouse 2 Son/daughter . Can your friend prove that any spouse has died?

Anyway, if the above is satisfied, they could send the records without that bit of information (although it might be the very reason your friend wants the records!)

[Olde Crone]

Ann

No, friend cannot prove any spouse has died although the marriage would have been before 1929, so seems likely spouse is dead.

I had originally thought they might have sent the records with stuff blacked out, but perhaps they don't do this in case people like me hold it up to the light, lol.

Just seems rather odd to me as I have never heard of anyone being refused records, given that she provided her birth cert in support of her request.

OC

[Merry]

I imagine the name is a commonplace one if your friend is unable to confirm the death of the first spouse or even know who she is, so I hope the RAF, who have been supplied with his name and rank, are looking at the right record!

[Olde Crone]

Yes, very common name. The whole thing is driving me demented, I only found out today that she had sent off for his records - I've been waiting patiently for THREE years for her to do this. She forgot to tell me she'd done it...................

OC

[annswabey]

I'm sure they have to give a reason for not supplying it.

I'd ring them and ask what that reason is.

[annswabey]

Another thought - could he have married again later and that wife might still be alive?

[Olde Crone]

No, he formed a relationship with my friend's mother and they were together for many years until he died.

She maintained the fiction that they were married "at Caxton Hall" (no trace of any marriage, let alone one at Caxton Hall) but confessed on her death bed to her youngest daughter that they hadn't married because he was already married and his wife would not divorce him.

OC

[Merry]

OC, was your friend's father's initials WAB?

*polishes crystal ball* :)

[annswabey]

Found this message I sent to you, OC in 2009!

I've recently received some RAF WW2 records. The man's widow (2nd or 3rd wife) is still alive, so she gave her permission. Received the records within a couple of months but they had removed details of his next of kin and sent a letter explaining the legal reasons whey they had removed it, although of course, not explaining exactly what the info was. I assume that as he was married to someone else when he joined up, they had removed wife's details in case his widow didn't know about any previous marriage.

Hope this doesn't happen for you, but it might!

I suppose the real reason infomation was removed in this case was that the previous wife might still have been alive as the man was born in 1917.

Found the letter I got back from the RAF which states

"the provision of information relating to (name removed) details of his next of kin would breach section 40 and 41 of the Act (Data Protection Act 1998) and be an invasion of privacy of any remaining immediate family members (section 44)

[Kit]

OC you have the name and a year. Start looking in newspapers for details.

Is there any way to search gaol records?

[Olde Crone]

Merry

Yup, you got it!

Ann

Thankyou, that's very interesting. I remember receiving this message now! I now need to prise the letter out of her to see exactly what they said - she is vague about details she doesn't think are important.

Kit

The surname is so common, a newspaper search would be impossible, especially as I don't know where he was when he went to prison (and I suppose it could have been military prison?)

I just don't know how to further this sesrch but if I don't do SOMETHING, she has decided she will use a "professional researcher". I've tried to explain that a PR won't have access to any records that are data-protected, but she won't listen to that.

OC

[annswabey]

I wonder whether his children are named in the documents? That might be the problem, as well as the wife.

I think they should still provide the basic info as described on the Veterans Agency site. This should include the Units he served with and dates. A TINY possibility is that there might be records for his squadron for the appropriate time which might mention his imprisonment

As you say, a professional researcher wouldn't help gaining access to his service record.

[Olde Crone]

Ann

Yes, I suspect that his first batch of children may be mentioned.

I'll tell her about her right to have basic information about his movements - as you say, that will at least be a help in pinning down possible places.

OC

[annswabey]

Have a read here about what information she should be able to obtain

http://www.mod.uk/DefenceInternet/AboutDefence/WhatWeDo/Personnel/ServiceRecords/MakingARequestForInformationHeldOnThePersonnelReco rdsOfDeceasedServicePersonnelAndHomeGuardRecords.h tm