View Full Version : Hester/Esther Harris from Overbury
Hi Jood, I might be able to help you My 5 X Great Grandmother was Hester/Esther Harris from Overbury married to John Harris. Where is your connection to them?
Can anyone relate to this person? I don't know her name, but would like to contact her again.
You peviously mentioned it here:
http://www.genealogistsforum.co.uk/Forum/showpost.php?p=156240&postcount=22
And if you google it turns up a member of FTF called Historymin.
Yes, Merry - that's where I found it again - I'm just hoping that person will contact me.
Ok will post there and see what happens.
Thanks
I can't get into this site tho - to re-read what it says - as it is in Ancestry
http://search.ancestry.co.uk/iexec?htx=view&r=5538&dbid=8860&iid=GLSHO107_1974_1974-0367&fn=Esther&ln=Harris&st=d&ssrc=&pid=7866097
and
http://search.ancestry.co.uk/iexec?htx=view&r=5538&dbid=8860&iid=GLSHO107_1974_1974-0353&fn=John&ln=Harris&st=d&ssrc=&pid=7865864
Anyone able to inform me?
The first one is the 1851 census for John and Esther Harris in Overbury with their son Job (say if you need more detail!)
The second is also the 1851 census of Overbury - John and Mary Harris and their dau Mary.
I'd like the first one Merry if that is ok - (The 1851 census for John and Esther Harris in Overbury with their son Job) I have the 2nd one - tho very hard to read.
John Harris head m 62 Ag Lab b Worcestershire Overbury
Esther Harris wife m 61 b Gloucestershire Beckford
Job Harris son unm 19 Ag Lab b Gloucestershire Tewkesbury
HO 107 1974 195 26
Sorry for the delay - I just did the school run!
Is there anythink you actually can't read on the other census? The ancestry copy is OK.
I think I have it right (the 1851 Census)
John Harris Head M 80 Shoe Maker Worc Conderton
Mary Harris Wife M 72 Worc Overbury
Mary Harris Dau ? 40 Silk Winder Worc Overbury
I think the ages are right, & I presume the younger Mary is unmarried - think I have the towns right, as they are what I'd hoped they would be.
Yes, that's right. At first glance I thought the daughter was 44 not 40, but zooming in I think 40 is correct. (there's one of those thick black lines through her age)
A bit confusing when you have a Mrs Mary Harris & a Miss Mary Harris - I'm thinking this might be the right Mary(the mother) - but still don't know her maiden name for sure.
Do you see them on the 1861 census when they should be
Charles & Thos b 1795 (these two might be deceased) - 66
Mary b 1797 64
John b 1801 60
Betty b 1801 60
Ann b 1803 58
Thomas b 1807 54
Actually I am guessing not - as the girls would have married and left home and the boy would also be married - or working away from home - so thats a no go.
How sure are you that those children you list all have the same parents? I know from my Smith research it's quite possible to have several families with parents of the same name having children at the same time in the same place. I see there is a John Harris marrying in Overbury in 1799 - I wonder if that's a late marriage, or a second marriage or there are two couples called John and Mary? Have you access to the burial records to check if there are any Mary Harris burials during this period?
I know Elizabeth Harris married John Cook on 7th September 1821 in Parish of Overbury, County of Worcester. Both Elizabeth and John signed with a cross, and witnesses were Thomas Smith and Thos. Harris.
(Maybe a possible brother Thos. Harris could be a clue)
The 1841 census shows Elizabeth & John Cook -
John Cook aged 42 (not of the parish),
Elizabeth Cook, 41, of the parish,
William 18,
Miriam 16,
Ann 14,
Joseph 11,
Mary 2,
Sarah, 6,
Martha 4 and
Rhoda 1.
also Mary Harris aged 82.
(which ties is with her death in 1843)
I have a baptism for Betty Harris 20 Dec 1801 Overbury, parents John and Mary.
I have a death cert for Mary Harris - Mary Harris died 26th Sept 1843 Overbury, Worcestershire - female, 84 years, widow of John Harris, Labourer.
Died of natural debility. The Mark x of Esther Harris, present at the death. Registered 27th Sept 1843. No. 332
Date of burial 30 Sept 1843. Age at death 87, calculated year of birth 1756, place of burial 1756 = dedication St Faith, Country Worcestershire.
The children you mentioned i.e in 1851 census
John Harris Head M 80 Shoe Maker Worc Conderton
Mary Harris Wife M 72 Worc Overbury
Mary Harris Dau ? 40 Silk Winder Worc Overbury
and
Charles & Thos b 1795 (these two might be deceased) - 66
Mary b 1797 64
John b 1801 60
Betty b 1801 60
Ann b 1803 58
Thomas b 1807 54
have not been entered in my tree - it was information given to me. Whether the Betty b 1801 and the Elizabeth who married in 1821 are one and the same - I don't know for sure.
Esther Harris (who was informant of death) could be another clue.
1851 census
John Harris head m 62 Ag Lab b Worcestershire Overbury
Esther Harris wife m 61 b Gloucestershire Beckford
Job Harris son unm 19 Ag Lab b Gloucestershire Tewkesbury
My thoughts, which I expect you have thought of too!
I do think John Harris b about 1770 who is married to Mary b about 1778 are the couple who married in 1799 (her surname given as Gilbird), as there's a baptism that fits for the bride: Mary Gilbert 22 Nov 1778 at Overbury, parents Thomas and Elizabeth Gilbert. (I think Gilbird is just a mistranscription!)
We know that Mary bap 1811 is theirs, as she is with them in 1851. I presume most of the other post 1799 baptisms for children of John and Mary belong to them too, but it's hard to say ALL, because there are more children baptised immediately before 1799 with the same parent names. if John b 1770 was married more than once (being 8 years older than his Mary - but have you seen the original marriage entry with 'condition'?) then those pre-1799 children might be his, in which case you would expect those with repeated names (Thomas 1795 and 1807 and Mary 1797 and 1811) to have been buried before the next child with the same name was baptised. If Thomas 1785 and Mary 1797 didn't die in time and/or John was a bachelor in 1799 then those children bap pre 1799 may belong to Mary who died in 1843. The big problem is - which couple does Betty 1801 belong to? John and Mary d 1843, John b 1770 and Mary b 1778 or a different couple altogether.
It would be tidy of John b 1770 was the son of Mary d 1843 (meaning that Mary might be either the mother or grandmother of Elizabeth Cook), but the ages are pretty tight and it seems far more likely that if Mary (d 1843) did have a son called John, he's the one married to Esther, and so Esther registered the death of her mother-in-law.
My brain is hurting now! lol
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