Elizabeth (unknown)

[Margaret in Burton]

Since completing the TO3GG for James Smith I have new info concerning him and in particular the name of his wife.

This is James:


http://www.genealogistsforum.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=7441


I couldn't complete the details for Elizabeth on the week that came up as I didn't know about her then.

Could do with some help now.

Elizabeth was born c 1793 in Knowle, Warwickshire

1841 they were living in Balsall Common, Warwickshire HO107; Piece 1129; Folio: 45; Page: 7

1851 they were living in Balsall, Warwickshire HO107; Piece: 2071; Folio: 285; Page: 5

1861 Elizabeth was a widow living at "Redfern", Hampton in Arden, Warwickshire RG9; Piece: 2217; Folio: 41; Page: 9

I can find no sign of her after that.

I can't find:

1. Her baptism (obviously need a maiden name for that)

2. Her marriage to James

3. Her possible re-marriage after his death

4. Her death

5. Any sign of her after 1861


HELP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Margaret in Burton]

I have to go offline for a while, will be back later.

[Merry]

What known children did James and Elizabeth have?

[Durham Lady]

Hampton in Arden came under Meriden Registration District and there is this death in 1864 that might be her, of course no age given.
Name: SMITH, Elizabeth
Registration district: Meriden
County: Warwickshire
Year of registration: 1864
Quarter of registration: Jul-Aug-Sep
Volume no: 6D
Page no: 241

[kiterunner]

That death is probably the Elizabeth Smith who was buried at Meriden 24 Jul 1864, abode Great Packington, age 88. I've found that Elizabeth Smith in Great Packington on the 1861 census so it is definitely a different person from the one Marg is looking for.

[kiterunner]

What known children did James and Elizabeth have?

I think this is them:

Baptised at Hampton in Arden, sons / daughters of James and Elizabeth Smith, Balsall, labourer:
17 Jan 1819 William
17 Jan 1820 Hannah
21 Feb 1824 Elizabeth
25 Apr 1826 another William
and 28 Jan 1830 Charles Smith baptised at Temple Balsall / Hampton in Arden, son of James and Elizabeth, Balsall St, labourer.

[kiterunner]

I found an Elizabeth Smith, widow, marrying 12 Feb 1866 to a Thomas Strickley in Kenilworth, with the banns being read at Temple Balsall, but her age is 63 so looks way too young. She is of the chapelry of Temple Balsall on the banns. Her father's name is John White, labourer, just in case.

Update:

Thomas Strickley is married on the 1871 census but his wife isn't with him. Piece 3197, folio 84, p 28.

Interestingly enough, there is an Elizabeth age 80, married, born Knowle, living at The Spring, Kenilworth, on the 1871 census. Ancestry have transcribed her surname as Steckley but it could well be Strickley. So I reckon that's her with her real age and she knocked a few (a lot!) years off when she married Thomas because she was so much older than him. Piece 3197, folio 29, p 16.

[kiterunner]

FamilySearch has a marriage 6 Feb 1815 at Haseley, Warwick, between James Smith and Elizabeth White. Also listed as "Worchester, England". Will see if I can find it on ancestry...

[kiterunner]

Browsing through the Haseley marriages for 1800-1824 on ancestry, image 4 has banns going up to Jan 1815 and then it goes to 1786! Then the next image is 1798-1800. Then it goes forward to about 1810 and then the last image is 1823-4. I can't see Feb 1815 in there anywhere. I wonder where FamilySearch got it from. If only we can find an image to check somewhere... but anyway, I bet it's them.

[Margaret in Burton]

What known children did James and Elizabeth have?

William 1819-1819
Hannah 1820-1896
Elizabeth 1824-
William 1826-
Charles 1829-1896
Isaac 1831-
Harriet 1835-

All born in Balsall Heath

[Margaret in Burton]

Hampton in Arden came under Meriden Registration District and there is this death in 1864 that might be her, of course no age given.
Name: SMITH, Elizabeth
Registration district: Meriden
County: Warwickshire
Year of registration: 1864
Quarter of registration: Jul-Aug-Sep
Volume no: 6D
Page no: 241

That death is probably the Elizabeth Smith who was buried at Meriden 24 Jul 1864, abode Great Packington, age 88. I've found that Elizabeth Smith in Great Packington on the 1861 census so it is definitely a different person from the one Marg is looking for.

Yes I agree

I have been checking the Warwickshire burials on Ancestry with no luck

[kiterunner]

Death registration Apr-Jun 1873 Solihull, Elizabeth Strickley, age 83, vol 6d p 297. Burial at Temple Balsall 20 Apr 1873, Elizabeth Strickley, abode Balsall, age looks like 80 but second digit is not very clear.

[Margaret in Burton]

I found an Elizabeth Smith, widow, marrying 12 Feb 1866 to a Thomas Strickley in Kenilworth, with the banns being read at Temple Balsall, but her age is 63 so looks way too young. She is of the chapelry of Temple Balsall on the banns. Her father's name is John White, labourer, just in case.

Update:

Thomas Strickley is married on the 1871 census but his wife isn't with him. Piece 3197, folio 84, p 28.

Interestingly enough, there is an Elizabeth age 80, married, born Knowle, living at The Spring, Kenilworth, on the 1871 census. Ancestry have transcribed her surname as Steckley but it could well be Strickley. So I reckon that's her with her real age and she knocked a few (a lot!) years off when she married Thomas because she was so much older than him. Piece 3197, folio 29, p 16.

I'll have a look at that

[Margaret in Burton]

FamilySearch has a marriage 6 Feb 1815 at Haseley, Warwick, between James Smith and Elizabeth White. Also listed as "Worchester, England". Will see if I can find it on ancestry...

Browsing through the Haseley marriages for 1800-1824 on ancestry, image 4 has banns going up to Jan 1815 and then it goes to 1786! Then the next image is 1798-1800. Then it goes forward to about 1810 and then the last image is 1823-4. I can't see Feb 1815 in there anywhere. I wonder where FamilySearch got it from. If only we can find an image to check somewhere... but anyway, I bet it's them.

Haseley is about 7-8 miles away from Knowle so could well be

[Margaret in Burton]

Death registration Apr-Jun 1873 Solihull, Elizabeth Strickley, age 83, vol 6d p 297. Burial at Temple Balsall 20 Apr 1873, Elizabeth Strickley, abode Balsall, age looks like 80 but second digit is not very clear.

Thanks Kate.

I'll look at all of this a little later. That may be a cert to send for.

[kiterunner]

Haseley has an OPC, so you could email him and see if he can look up the 1815 marriage?

http://www.hunimex.com/warwick/opc/opc.html#H

[Margaret in Burton]

Haseley has an OPC, so you could email him and see if he can look up the 1815 marriage?

http://www.hunimex.com/warwick/opc/opc.html#H

I've never used an OPC before. Do they charge?

[kiterunner]

No, it's against their principles:
http://www.onlineparishclerks.org.uk/

[Margaret in Burton]

No, it's against their principles:
http://www.onlineparishclerks.org.uk/

I'll get onto that then

[Margaret in Burton]

So, now I am looking for an Elizabeth White father John born Knowle c 1793

I need to find a baptism

[kiterunner]

I had a quick look earlier on and didn't see one in Knowle but a few possibles in other parishes. But I would need to look at a map to see whether any of those parishes were anywhere near Knowle. I guess the marriage record might help.

Edit - I didn't note down the names of the witnesses at her second marriage (the one to Thomas Strickley) but guessing they are probably not her siblings - can you view that one o.k. on ancestry or do you need a copy of it sending, Marg?

[Margaret in Burton]

I had a quick look earlier on and didn't see one in Knowle but a few possibles in other parishes. But I would need to look at a map to see whether any of those parishes were anywhere near Knowle. I guess the marriage record might help.

Edit - I didn't note down the names of the witnesses at her second marriage (the one to Thomas Strickley) but guessing they are probably not her siblings - can you view that one o.k. on ancestry or do you need a copy of it sending, Marg?

I have Ancestry Kate. Just haven't had chance to look yet.

Thanks again

[Margaret in Burton]

Just looking at all of this now and have emailed the OPC.

[Anstey Nomad]

I hate to raise this Marg, but is that Thomas StRickley, or Thomas Stickley?

Reason I mention it is that the Kenilworth Stickleys are Mr Nomad's on his mother's side...

AN

[Anstey Nomad]

Right, I've had me tea now and dug out MIL's Stickley research.

I offer you, as Elizabeth's bridegroom, Thomas Stickley, born in Butlers Marston Warwickshire c1807, the first of the family to move to Kenilworth. He left South Warwickshire in the 1830s.

He's on the 1861 in Kenilworth as a widower.

http://search.ancestry.co.uk/iexec?htx=view&r=5538&dbid=8767&iid=WARRG9_2223_2226-0405&fn=Thomas&ln=Stricklen&st=r&ssrc=&pid=21373655

I note that his son is called Richard which, if I'm right, would be the name of a paternal uncle and his paternal grandfather.

According to MIL, Thomas married a woman from Birmingham and had eight children (all of whom she omitted from her family tree!) but I'm not sure that I have the strength to search for Richard's seven siblings tonight, especially when everyone appears to be mis-indexed.

Ultimately Thomas was joined in Kenilworth by his nephew William (1832-1899) who begat Walter, who begat Elsie June, who begat June who begat Mr Nomad.

You know what this could mean Marg, don't you?

AN

[Margaret in Burton]

Yep. It means after all these years I am related by marriage to Mr Nomad. We knew we were connected somewhere.

[Margaret in Burton]

I found an Elizabeth Smith, widow, marrying 12 Feb 1866 to a Thomas Strickley in Kenilworth, with the banns being read at Temple Balsall, but her age is 63 so looks way too young. She is of the chapelry of Temple Balsall on the banns. Her father's name is John White, labourer, just in case.

Update:

Thomas Strickley is married on the 1871 census but his wife isn't with him. Piece 3197, folio 84, p 28.

Interestingly enough, there is an Elizabeth age 80, married, born Knowle, living at The Spring, Kenilworth, on the 1871 census. Ancestry have transcribed her surname as Steckley but it could well be Strickley. So I reckon that's her with her real age and she knocked a few (a lot!) years off when she married Thomas because she was so much older than him. Piece 3197, folio 29, p 16.


Only just getting chance to have a proper look at this:
Definitely the right Thomas as one of the witnesses on the marriage to Elizabeth Smith was Ann Hope. On this census he is living with James Hope and wife Ann and described as father in law.

[Margaret in Burton]

Right, I've had me tea now and dug out MIL's Stickley research.

I offer you, as Elizabeth's bridegroom, Thomas Stickley, born in Butlers Marston Warwickshire c1807, the first of the family to move to Kenilworth. He left South Warwickshire in the 1830s.

He's on the 1861 in Kenilworth as a widower.

http://search.ancestry.co.uk/iexec?htx=view&r=5538&dbid=8767&iid=WARRG9_2223_2226-0405&fn=Thomas&ln=Stricklen&st=r&ssrc=&pid=21373655

I note that his son is called Richard which, if I'm right, would be the name of a paternal uncle and his paternal grandfather.

According to MIL, Thomas married a woman from Birmingham and had eight children (all of whom she omitted from her family tree!) but I'm not sure that I have the strength to search for Richard's seven siblings tonight, especially when everyone appears to be mis-indexed.

Ultimately Thomas was joined in Kenilworth by his nephew William (1832-1899) who begat Walter, who begat Elsie June, who begat June who begat Mr Nomad.

You know what this could mean Marg, don't you?

AN



It makes Mr Nomad the 3rd great grand nephew of the husband of MY 3rd great grandmother.

:D:D:D:D:eek::eek::eek:;););):p:p

[Uncle John]

It makes Mr Nomad the 3rd great grand nephew of the husband of MY 3rd great grandmother.

You should definitely amalgamate your trees. Some of the twigs on my tree are even more remotely connected!