How do I search for records of a person who may have been adopted

[Zoemcdougall]

My cousin is trying to find out who the father of his mum's eldest sister was,

Evelyn Lucas was the Daughter of Edith Lucas nee Jones, Edith had 6 children, 5 of the children born to Edith & William Jack Lucas. Evelyn was born before Jack & Edith got married. My cousin believes that Jack adopted her.

Evelyn herself thought that Jack wasn't her father. She even wrote to my Grandafather (Brother to Edith) asking whether Jack was her father but don't know whether my Grandfather ever wrote back, he was very close to Edith & I am certain she would have told him. Evelyn couldn't ask mother as Edith spent most of her life in Fairmile hospital.

Zoe

[Merry]

I'm no expert on adoption, but as far as I know an individuals adoption records cannot be accessed by anyone other than the adoptee. I assume Evelyn Lucas is no longer alive?

I'm also assuming there is no father's name on her original birth cert, as I guess Evelyn would have looked into that herself.

[Olde Crone]

I agree with Merry, adoption records (even so-called Mother's Own adoptions) are private and the papers can only be accessed by the adoptee.

It does seem very unlikely that Jack was her natural father, as if he was, he didn't need to adopt her, they just needed to re-register her birth with his name on the cert.

If Evelyn was adopted (by anyone) then her birth certificate will bear the words "adopted" in the right hand column.

Finally, I think you will have an impossible job to discover who her natural father was, unless someone in the family knows.

OC

OC

[Zoemcdougall]

Yes Merry, Evelyn is no alive, she do in 1984. I don.t have birth cert, My cousin didn't mention if he has it, I'm assuming he hasn't as I think he would have said. I have the letter Evelyn sent to my grandfather,asking for his help. As she knew he was the only one in the family who had anything to do with her mother.

[Merry]

Her death registration should help you find the right birth registration, especally if you know where abouts she was born. If you can be sure of the right birth registration index entry it may be ossible to work out from the index if there's a chance her father is named, but you can never ben 100% sure without the cert.

[JessBow]

what surname is one her birth cert?
or in the index for that matter?

[Merry]

Jess, I found her on several family trees on Ancestry,

Evelyn Katherine B Lucas
Birth: 9 Feb 1927 - Flintshire, Wales (some say St Asaph)
Death: 2 Jul 1984 - Swindon, Wiltshire, England
Marriage: Mar 1946 - Swindon, Wiltshire to Lionel W Steele

but I can't find her at birth with those forenames, and it gets difficult if her birth surname was Jones!

[Merry]

The best fit I can see for birth is 1927 Q3 in Holywell district. Surname Jones, mmn Jones and only two forenames in the wrong order. It shows on FreeBMD and North Wales BMD.

[kiterunner]

Her death registration gives her date of birth as 2 Sep 1927, according to both ancestry and FMP.

[Oakum Picker]

I think the difference in birth date is that Ancestry has recorded it in 'American' 9/2 instead of 'British' 2/9.

[Merry]

Birth: 9 Feb 1927 - Flintshire, Wales

Doh, sorry, I didn't notice that version had the date round the wrong way! lol

[Zoemcdougall]

Thankyou for your replies, My Dad is over from North Wales, asked him about Evelyn, but couldn't. Remember that much than I had already posted, I have also spoken to another member of the family, but would only confirm her year of birth. As being 1927 not the year of birth my cousin gave mr.

[Merry]

If the 1927 birth reg I mentioned earlier is the right one (and I guess we can't be very sure it is without seeing the cert) then it's unlikely there is a father's name on it, unless the father's name was Jones too (possible!). There only appears to be one record in the index and if the father was recorded, but had a different surname and the couple were not married, there should be two index entries - one for each surname.

[Zoemcdougall]

what would you advise my cousin to do, should he order the birth cert, if so would you know what the reference no. is.

[Merry]

If it was my tree I wouldn't do anything, but if your cousin wants to get the birth cert to be 100% sure there is no father's name on it, then I would suggest going to the North Wales BMD site:

http://www.northwalesbmd.org.uk/cgi/birthind.cgi?county=northwales


and doing a search for 1927 only for the surname Jones, and Region Flintshire (Mold). This gives a lot of results, but if you scroll down to the Ks (not Es!) you wll see the one that might be right. Click the ref at the right-hand end and then click it again on the next page to get the order form. When you send off the form and cheque you can give qualifying info about the mother (ie her first name) and they will return your cheque if that info doesn't match. I don't know whether you should also include the dob - I probably wouldn't as you don't know where the death informant got their information. You could also say there should be an A for adopted in the last column (see OC's earlier post), but again if the info you have about a legal adoption isn't right, then it might not appear on the certificate.

[Zoemcdougall]

Thankyou Merry, I will pass this on to my cousin. He can decide whether he wants to order the birth cert.

I know you shouldn't mix threads but Just wants to say on my search for Edward Jones I'm going to the records office tomorrow, I'll let you know how I get on Via my thread of Edward Jones.

[Merry]

Good luck!

[Zoemcdougall]

Thank you Merry

[Zoemcdougall]

Merry, I have just looked on the link you gave me, then looked on Ancestry for Kathleen Evelyn, and there was one their with the mother' name of Jones, with the reference

pg 270 Vol 11b, could this possibly the same person from the link you gave me.

[Merry]

Yes, it is, but you (or your cousin) could save your money if it's the wrong cert if you apply via the local office.

[JBee]

Sorry off the top of my head when did legal adoptions take place?

Would she have been legally adopted???

[kiterunner]

It started in 1927 and that is when she was born.

[Zoemcdougall]

My cousin that I am doing the research for has ordered the birth cert that Merry mentions in the thread so hopefully it will give him a bit more info, will let you know when he recieves it & what it says.