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View Full Version : Help find a mariner in 1851


Macbev
30-03-12, 17:24
Being a great believer in casting my bread on many waters, I confess I have already posted this elsewhere, but hope someone on this forum may be able too help.

I am trying to assist a friend to find her ancestor, of whom little is known before his arrival in the Swan River colony, apart from a few details garnered from contemporary newspapers.

What is known
1. William BROWN, employed as coxswain for the Water Police in Fremantle, married Mary GREADY/GRADY in the R.C church, Fremantle 6 Mar 1852
2. There were 13 children born between 1853 and 1875, several of whom bear the unusual middle name of GROUNDSEL. One has the middle name GAFFNEY
3. William died 19 Sep 1884, a day or so after his wife, and allegedly was aged 59, which gives him a birth date of abt 1825
4. His obit claims he arrived in the Swan River Colony in 1851 on board the Mermaid
5. The Mermaid was a convict ship carrying not only convicts but Pensioner Guards with their families. There is an online transcription of the passengers of this ship but there is no William Brown listed among either convicts or Pensioner Guards
6. William's marriage certificate states that he was a mariner, which probably explains his employment by the Water Police as coxswain after his arrival. I have read an account of another crew member which infers that most of the crew were discharged when they reached Fremantle -so I am guessing that if William likewise was a member of the crew, it would explain why his name is not on the Mermaid lists.

Given that the family may have got their story wrong and that William may possibly have arrived on another ship, is there anywhere we can look to confirm/ refute his arrival as part of the crew of the Mermaid?

If crew lists exist, will they give further details as to place of birth or anything, in fact, that will help us place this not very uncommon name in the UK?

Off to bed now, but will check in my morning for any responses.

Merry
30-03-12, 17:44
According to The Times the Mermaid sailed from Spithead to Swan River with 150 prisoners from Portland and from the Parkhurst Reformatory Prison on Fri 3rd Jan 1851. (EDIT and it stopped off at Portsmouth and resumed sailing on 9th Jan). If he was on that ship then he won't be on the 1851 census which was taken on 30th March.

Maybe there was a second sailing the same year?

Macbev
30-03-12, 17:55
I am not expecting to find him on the census, Merry. I just want to know if it is possible to find a crew list for the Mermaid, as he does not show up as a convict or a Pensioner Guard. I haven't dealt with mariners before and don't know where to look.

Merry
30-03-12, 18:02
The name Groundsel(l) seems to be predominantly from Sussex.

kiterunner
30-03-12, 18:02
Most crew lists aren't online (yet).

Merry
30-03-12, 18:06
I am not expecting to find him on the census, Merry.

lol sorry - I thought the title of this thread meant the census! :o

kiterunner
30-03-12, 18:09
Also if he is on a crew list from that date, I don't think it will give his birthplace.

Merry
30-03-12, 18:14
I have just done a search o FMP merchant navy seamen records with William Brown b 1825+/- 2 years there are about 300+ results with a year/date of birth/age recorded and several more hundred that don't. A common name, as you say!

kiterunner
30-03-12, 18:20
Does his marriage certificate give any details of his parents, Bev? The index on ancestry shows no parents' names on his death registration.

kiterunner
30-03-12, 18:30
Are the Fremantle Freemasons records available. Bev? I see that in one of the newspaper reports of his death on Trove, it says that the Freemasons of the Fremantle Lodge attended his funeral. Though I don't know whether Freemason records would actually help.

Merry
30-03-12, 18:32
Do you know if it was because of his wife's background that they married in an RC church?

Macbev
31-03-12, 05:01
Thanks for the input, Kite and Merry. I did wonder about the FMP records, as I don't have a sub there. I suspect the only way to locate my William Brown from among the other 300+ Wm Browns listed would be if there was a correlation with a ship :(

I will ask my friend to show me the actual marr.cert when I see her on Wednesday....there might be something else she didn't mention (being new to the game, she may not have realised its significance). I somehow got the feeling this chap was not a convict......his career in Fremantle does not have the same 'feel' about it as other convicts I have researched - if that makes sense. And I doubt if a convict would have been invited to become a corporal in the local Volunteer Forces (a sort of Territorial Army).

The thought about the Freemasons is a good one....I'll ask around on the local lists.

And just to complicate matters, there was another William Brown died in Fremantle the same year as our chap....no age given, no known details...suspect he is the William Brown from Somerset, who arrived as convict 508 in 1851 on board the Pyrenees. In fact, until I found the news articles referring to the Mermaid, my friend had claimed this convict as her own :D

Macbev
31-03-12, 05:06
Oops, didn't see your post overpage, Merry. Yes, I imagine his wife, as a good Irish lass, would have insisted on an R.C marriage. This was quite a common pattern as a lot of Irish girls were brought out to the colony to become brides...no women convicts were ever transported here and it was a male-heavy settlement.

I haven't located his burial yet, so I don't know if he was buried in the RC part of the cemetery or the Anglican bit.

Merry
31-03-12, 06:55
I did wonder about the FMP records, as I don't have a sub there. I suspect the only way to locate my William Brown from among the other 300+ Wm Browns listed would be if there was a correlation with a ship

I have around 30 merchant seamen on my tree (probably more), but only found about ten records on FMP. I don't recall any of the ones I saved having any ship details on them, though I did see a few that did whilst I was searching.

bidston
31-03-12, 08:26
i saw the mention of freemasons in freemantle and thought i would chip in, masonic records are very detailed and perfectly preserved and go back hundreds of years

the lodges in perth and freemantle at that time would have been english or scottish constitution, many are still operational today, those that have merged due to few numbers attending will still have their records preserved

freemasonry in WA is very open not like in the UK and they have a main temple and offices in perth, you should follow this up as a lot of detail may be available

the fact that freemasons attended the funeral means he was a mason himself of some standing and his brother masons were showing their respects

Phoenix
02-04-12, 13:23
I have around 30 merchant seamen on my tree (probably more), but only found about ten records on FMP. I don't recall any of the ones I saved having any ship details on them, though I did see a few that did whilst I was searching.

The early ones do have both ships and port of destination & arrival noted. Unfortunately, they use a numerical code for these details.