Martha Chapman -nee Gooch?

[Sue from Southend]

It's looks obvious to me but can someone confirm for me that the Mary Ann Green that witnesses two of these marriages is the same as the Mary Ann Gooch who marries James Green.

James Green/Mary Ann Gooch
http://search.ancestry.co.uk/iexec?htx=View&r=5538&dbid=1623&iid=31280_199086-00307&fn=Mary+Ann&ln=Gooch&st=d&ssrc=&pid=7849944

John Morden/Eliza Ann Gooch
http://search.ancestry.co.uk/iexec?htx=View&r=5538&dbid=1623&iid=31280_197726-00450&fn=Eliza+Ann&ln=Gooch&st=d&ssrc=&pid=7053824

Charles Chapman/Martha Gooch
http://search.ancestry.co.uk/iexec?htx=View&r=5538&dbid=1623&iid=31280_197571-00029&fn=Martha&ln=Gooch&st=d&ssrc=&pid=6798433

The reason I'm doubting myself is that if I'm right it makes my 3x GtGrandmother 13 yrs old when she had my 2x gt grandmother!

[kiterunner]

The signatures look the same, but can you explain why it makes your 3xgt-grandmother 13 when she had your 2xg-grandmother, please?

[Sue from Southend]

I should have qualified that statement by saying that she may have been only 13 if the marriage is the right one!

This is Martha in 3x ggp http://www.genealogistsforum.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=8890

The only marriage I can find is the one between Martha Gooch and Charles Chapman in 1835 but their eldest child (Mary Ann) was born in 1826 (baptised in 1828). There is a Martha Gooch b1813 (bapt. 1815) to a John and Mary Ann Gooch who also have two other daughters, Mary Ann and Eliza as in the above marriages. I'm confident that they are all the same family but still have reservations whether it's my Martha.

I can't see any other Charles and Martha Chapmans in 1841 and having just checked she states then that she was born in 1811....

I'd be happy for more input.

Off swimming now! Will check back later.

[kiterunner]

If it is the right couple and they got married in 1835 then quite a few of the children were born before the marriage. Could be because they had to wait until Martha was 21? Or it could be a different Martha who was the mother of the older children?

[Merry]

Maybe that is the right marriage but Martha was a cousin of the one whose bap you have seen? I see yours was b about 1802 according to the 1841 and 1851 census - what age does it say on her death cert?

[Sue from Southend]

She died in Aug 1853 aged 52, Merry.

I obviously misremembered the dob in 1841 in my earlier post!

I have looked at this marriage before for Martha and Charles but could never definitely pin it to them. One of their sons was christened William Rumsby Chapman which I thought might be some sort of clue but I've never worked out the answer if it is!

[Merry]

Apart from the obvious bit of the marriage being significantly after the first child(ren) also the groom in that marriage didn't use his middle name. Was his middle name on his death record?

[Sue from Southend]

I haven't got his death, Merry. The Charles James Chapman in the GRO index for 1852 is a 5mth old, son of a Robert Chapman. There are too many other Charles Chapmans for me to hazard a guess although it should be in the Shoreditch/St Lukes areas.

[Merry]

Pity she stopped having children just before civil reg :(

[Sue from Southend]

I've been saying that for a long time!

I'll just have to keep the Gooch family on the back burner in case something turns up at a later date.....