William Richardson FMMMFF

[ElizabethHerts]

The only details I have about William Richardson come from his son Charles Richardson's death certificate which state his name and occpation and his wife's name.

Link to his son Charles Richardson:http://www.genealogistsforum.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=8504&highlight=Charles+Richardson

Name - "official" name and what they were known as
William Richardson

Date and place of birth
c. 1788 Aberlour Banffshire Scotland

Names of parents
Unknown

Date and place of baptism - if applicable
Unknown

Details of each of his or her marriages - if any
To Ann McDonald
Date and place unknown

Occupation(s) - if any
Farm servant

Addresses where they lived (including county if in UK)
Aberlour, Banffshire

Date, place and cause of death
unknown

Date and place of burial
unknown

Details of will / administration of their estate - if applicable
unknown - unlikely

Memorial inscription - if any
unknown

[kiterunner]

How do you know he was born in Aberlour, Elizabeth?

[ElizabethHerts]

Good question, Kate!

Probably because on my Scottish side I have relied on other peoples' research a lot more than with my English family. *blushes*

http://wc.rootsweb.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/igm.cgi?op=GET&db=sandberg&id=I37400

Of course, his place of birth needs verifying with hard facts.

[kiterunner]

I can't find anything about William, Ann, or Charles's marriage to Jane / Jean anywhere except in people's trees! Do you have an exact date for Charles and Jane's marriage? It says 1835 Glass on people's trees but it isn't on Scotland's People as far as I can see.

[kiterunner]

Did Charles ever name a son William? I can't see mention of one in your thread about Charles.

[ElizabethHerts]

Kate, this is the information from Charles Richardson's death certificate:

1877 10th October 8 pm at Lintmill Seafield Rathven Banffshire Charles Richardson, retired farmer, 63 years, died. Erysipelas* 14 days. Death notified by Ann Richardson, daughter, present.
Parents:
William Richardson Farm Servant (deceased)
Ann Richardson M.S. McDonald (deceased)


Initially I found Scottish research very difficult. All I knew was my grandmother's maiden name. She was born in Dumfries, and my mother had been looking round there for information. However, it transpired that her parents came from much further north.


To return to your question, there were no children called William.
I have descendants for most of the siblings, and a few emigrated.

Perhaps Charles was lying about his parentage?
I think some GR members took pity on me, and I found more information about the families. However, the earlier information is very sketchy, and for want of anything better I have been using it.

I have had contact with a few people but the real stumbling block is the absence of marriages. Someone told me that Scottish marriages could be very casual with not much ceremony or official proof. I don't know if that is correct.

[kiterunner]

There is a possible for William on the 1841 and 1851 censuses according to ancestry, at Waulkmill, Mortlach, Banffshire.

In 1841 he is 50 born county, gardener, and in 1851 he is age 64, ag lab, born Boharm Banffshire. He has a wife Isabella who is 55 in 1841 and in 1851 she is 67 born Inveravon Banffshire. Her surname is transcribed as Sternat on the 1841 so probably should be Stewart? They have a daughter Janet or Jannet with them and in 1851 she is 39 born Aberlour, so she could be Charles's sister. There is another daughter Elisabeth Murray who is 3 years younger than Janet, also born Aberlour. I'm not sure where Elisabeth is in 1841.

Not found a birth for Janet yet.

In 1861 Isabella is a widow but I can't see a death for William so I guess he died before civil registration came in in 1855. There is a death for Isabella Richardson, other surname Stewart, in Banffshire between 1861 and 1871, age between 78 and 88.

Guess what? I can't find a William Richardson / Isabella Stewart marriage. Not really surprising! I was hoping to find a date so we could see if Isabella was a second wife or not. Her death registration should give the names of all her husbands though.

Also if we can find Janet's death registration it should have her parents' names, as accurately as the informant's knowledge allowed. She is a servant in 1861. Of course we don't know for sure whether she is Charles's sister yet. Oh, and / or Elisabeth's death reg but she could be Charles's stepsister if Isabella wasn't his mother.

[kiterunner]

Someone told me that Scottish marriages could be very casual with not much ceremony or official proof. I don't know if that is correct.

Absolutely correct as far as I know, but it was me who told you that!

[kiterunner]

Okay, FamilySearch has a birth for James Murray (grandson who is with William and Isabella in 1841 and 1851) - born 16 Nov 1836 at Mortlach Banffshire, parents Alexander Murray and Elizabeth Richardson. They also had a son William born 25 Aug 1839 but I can't see their marriage.

[ElizabethHerts]

Kate, after a busy week I fell asleep on the settee! I shall read what you have discovered in detail now and get back to you asap - WHEN I FIND MY GLASSES! Lol!

[ElizabethHerts]

Right, glasses found on top of the potatoes! :d

So this is them in 1851 according to FMP:

Address: Waulk Mill, Waulk Mill, Mortlach

RICHARDSON, William Head Married M 64 1787 Ag Labourer Boharm Banff
RICHARDSON, Isabella Wife Married F 67 1784 Inveravon Banff
RICHARDSON, Jannet Daughter Unmarried F 39 1812 Home Aberlour Banff
MURRAY, Elisabath Daughter Widow F 36 1815 Home Aberlour Banff
MURRAY, James Grand Son Unmarried M 14 1837 Scholar Mortlach Banff
MURRAY, Isabella Grand Daughter Unmarried F 7 1844 Scholar Mortlach Banff
SELLAR, William Grand Son Unmarried M 11 1840 Scholar Mortlach Banff
FLEMING, William Grand Son Unmarried M 4 1847 Home Mortlach Banff

[ElizabethHerts]

This is FMP's contribution for 1841. I'll check ScotlandsPeople in a minute.

Address: Buchromb House, Buchromb House, Mortlach

RICHARDSON, Willm M 50 1791 Gardener Banffshire
STEWART, Isabella F 55 1786 Banffshire
RICHARDSON, Jannet F 25 1816 Banffshire
STEWART, Willm M 10 1831 Banffshire
MURRAY, James M 4 1837 Banffshire
SELLAR, Willm M 1 1840 Banffshire
ROSS, Donald M 25 1816 Ag Lab Banffshire
GRANT, John M 20 1821 Mason Banffshire
CUMMING, Peter M 20 1821 Mason Banffshire

[ElizabethHerts]

Isabella Richardson is a widow in 1861:

Address: Walkmill, Marnoch

RICHARDSON, Isabella Widow F 78 1783 Pauper (Gardners W) Inveravon Banffshire
MURRAY, Elisabeth Widow F 45 1816 Daughter (Farm Serv W) Aberlour Banffshire
MCDONALD, James Unmarried M 29 1832 Mason Aberlour Banffshire

[ElizabethHerts]

1861 census:

Address: Crachie Street, Marnoch

GORDON, Isabela Unmarried F 87 1774 Fund Holder Mortlach Banffshire
RICHARDSON, Janet Unmarried F 47 1814 Domestic ServantAberdour Banffshire

[ElizabethHerts]

So, if this is Charles' family, we have:


Janet Richardson born c. 1812 to 1816
Elisabeth Richardson born 1815/1816

and

Charles Richardson born c. 1814/1815

Perhaps Ann McDonald was not William's wife??

[ElizabethHerts]

Right, glasses found on top of the potatoes! :d

So this is them in 1851 according to FMP:

Address: Waulk Mill, Waulk Mill, Mortlach

RICHARDSON, William Head Married M 64 1787 Ag Labourer Boharm Banff
RICHARDSON, Isabella Wife Married F 67 1784 Inveravon Banff
RICHARDSON, Jannet Daughter Unmarried F 39 1812 Home Aberlour Banff
MURRAY, Elisabath Daughter Widow F 36 1815 Home Aberlour Banff
MURRAY, James Grand Son Unmarried M 14 1837 Scholar Mortlach Banff
MURRAY, Isabella Grand Daughter Unmarried F 7 1844 Scholar Mortlach Banff
SELLAR, William Grand Son Unmarried M 11 1840 Scholar Mortlach Banff
FLEMING, William Grand Son Unmarried M 4 1847 Home Mortlach Banff

Name: William Sellar
Gender: Male
Baptism/Christening Date: 29 Sep 1839
Baptism/Christening Place: MORTLACH,BANFF,SCOTLAND
Birth Date: 26 Sep 1839
Father's Name: John Sellar
Mother's Name: Janet Richardson
Mother's Birthplace:
Mother's Age:
Indexing Project (Batch) Number: C11162-4

Interesting - I assume they didn't marry.

[ElizabethHerts]

right, glasses found on top of the potatoes! :d

so this is them in 1851 according to fmp:

Address: Waulk mill, waulk mill, mortlach

richardson, william head married m 64 1787 ag labourer boharm banff
richardson, isabella wife married f 67 1784 inveravon banff
richardson, jannet daughter unmarried f 39 1812 home aberlour banff
murray, elisabath daughter widow f 36 1815 home aberlour banff
murray, james grand son unmarried m 14 1837 scholar mortlach banff
murray, isabella grand daughter unmarried f 7 1844 scholar mortlach banff
sellar, william grand son unmarried m 11 1840 scholar mortlach banff
fleming, william grand son unmarried m 4 1847 home mortlach banff


20/10/1846 fleming william william fleming/margaret richardson fr603 m mortlach /banff

[kiterunner]

Hopefully somewhere there will be a link between this family and Charles Richardson. The trouble is with this kind of problem in Scottish trees is you have to keep paying to view more and more stuff on SP so it can take a long time if you don't want to buy too many credits all at once.

It could be that Ann McDonald is the wrong name, of course, since it's only from Charles's death cert.

[ElizabethHerts]

Kite, I got through £7 of credits last night and that was on census entries which were transcribed on FMP, so I got nothing extra.

I can't find a death for William Richardson at present, which is most frustrating.

The information on these trees is OK up to a certain point, but they make too many assumptions as they go further back without the backing of PRs and census entries.

[maggie_4_7]

I assume you've seen the marriage of William Richardson to Isabel Stuart 23rd June 1810 Aberlour Banff.

[ElizabethHerts]

Oh, no, Maggie, I hadn't. Is it on FamilySearch?

[maggie_4_7]

Yes.

On the old search though can't find it on the new site search

Batch No 7526716
Sheet 73
Source call out 0884636
Type Film

I don't know if links to searches work but maybe;-

http://www.familysearch.org/eng/search/frameset_search.asp?PAGE=igi/search_IGI.asp&clear_form=true

[ElizabethHerts]

Thanks, Maggie, I've got it now.

[kiterunner]

I can find a death for William Richardson at present, which is most frustrating.


He probably died before civil registration started in 1855, and not all Scottish parishes recorded burials, so there may be no record of his death.

[ElizabethHerts]

That's what I thought, Kate. I can see I won't get much further on this line.

[maggie_4_7]

I know this is William's thread but have you looked for a baptism under the name McDonald rather than Richardsonfor Charles?

[ElizabethHerts]

That's a good idea, Maggie, I hadn't thought of that.

My idea at present is that William Richardson married Isabella Stuart but during the marriage also fathered Charles with Ann McDonald.

We have a similar scenario with Jane Archibald, Charles Richardson's wife.
Her parents were William Archibald and Jane Mallice, but William and Jane weren't married. William Archibald was married to Jannet Richardson - OOH! Double take! Of course I knew that but I wonder if there is any connection!

My Scottish ancestors went in for illegitimacy in a big way! LOL!

[kiterunner]

Well, the marriage that Maggie found is on Scotland's People, so you could view the image which may or may not have extra info, but I suppose that isn't going to help until we know for sure that they are Charles's parents.

The old FamilySearch also has a submitted christening for Jane Richardson 25 Oct 1818 at Aberlour, Banff, parents William Richardson and Isabel Stuart. This is also on Scotland's People. But I can't find baptisms for the rest of the children.

[maggie_4_7]

errrrr just a minite I just searched nothing came up but on SP

There are three baptisms in Aberlour between 1805 and 1818:-

Elizabeth Baptised 1805 - parents John Richardson and Ann McDonald
James Baptised 1809 - parents John Richardson and Ann McDonald

Jane Richardson baptised 1818 - parents William Richardson and Isabel Stuart

So I think you have two families and if Ann McDonald was Charles mother then his father is John Richardson or illegitimately William.

Illegitimacy wasn't a big deal in Scotland from the records I have looked at a couple of my ancestors never married and didn't seem to care their children were baptised with the word Natural rather than Lawful.

[kiterunner]

That's interesting. There is also a John Richardson baptised at Boharm, Moray, 27 Feb 1803, parents John Richardson and Ann McDonald. (on the new FamilySearch.) Boharm is William Richardson's birthplace on the 1851 census.

[ElizabethHerts]

Maggie, wow! Perhaps the informant got the wrong father for Charles?
A shame there is no Charles.

Off to SP again.

[kiterunner]

Findmypast lists a John Richardson age 78 in Aberlour on the 1841 census - ancestry has him as 18 but with a Hellen Richardson age 74 so I think FMP is more likely to be right.

[ElizabethHerts]

Someone has an Ancestral File on FamilySearch:

https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.2.1/MCKD-5L4


I have also found this:
Name: John Richardson
Gender: Male
Baptism/Christening Date: 27 Feb 1803
Baptism/Christening Place: BOHARM,MORAY,SCOTLAND
Father's Name: John Richardson
Mother's Name: Ann Mcdonald
Indexing Project (Batch) Number: C11128-2

[kiterunner]

Bother, there are baptisms at Boharm for children of John Richardson and Helen Fleming: James 10 May 1801, Ann 3 Apr 1803 and Andrew 28 Jun 1807. The name Fleming has already come up somewhere on this thread, hasn't it?

[ElizabethHerts]

Bother, there are baptisms at Boharm for children of John Richardson and Helen Fleming: James 10 May 1801, Ann 3 Apr 1803 and Andrew 28 Jun 1807. The name Fleming has already come up somewhere on this thread, hasn't it?

Yes, Margaret Richardson (dr of William) married William Fleming.
child William born c. 1847

[kiterunner]

FreeREG has some Aberlour baptisms but not for the time period that we need.

[ElizabethHerts]

Thanks for you continuing help, Kite.

Just for the record these are Charles's children, which might give a clue as to his parentage:

Robert
Janet
Charles
John
Isabella
Helen
Elizabeth
James
Ann
Charles

[kiterunner]

We need his wife's parents' names in there too, if possible, Elizabeth.

[ElizabethHerts]

Jane Archibald's parents were:

William Archibald
Jane Mallice

from Jane's death certificate

[kiterunner]

Oh dear, it looks as though they weren't following the traditional naming pattern then, unless there is a William missing from the list of children.

[ElizabethHerts]

I don't think they were big on naming patterns!