Rebecca Wiggins

[lozaras]

Rebecca Wiggins

born about 1780

christened the child I know about at St Giles Cripplegate, London, England

I guessed her dob from her son's christening date (in 1806, IGI batch C025779). The father was listed as Richard Payne. There IS a marriage in the right area (Southwark) for these names but it's much later (06.01.1820)

There is a Rebecca Payne on the 1841 census HO107 b7 folio 56 p6 in St Olaves Union Workhouse aged 60 (born in county)

There is also a burial for a Rebecca Payne 28.08.1847, aged 67, at Horsleydown St John, Southwark.

Her son is here:http://www.genealogistsforum.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=10034&highlight=john+payne

[Merry]

The baptism for John is on Ancestry - the parents are helpfully indexed as Richd Rayne and Reba Wiggins! Richard's occ is 'turner'.

The Richard at the 1820 marriage IS a widower..............

[lozaras]

... but he married another Rebecca Wiggins ???

I have very little brain at this time of night.

.... most of the time actually.

What do you think happened, Merry?

[Merry]

?????? I am confused too!

I thought you were saying John Payne was born to unmarried parents in 1805/6 and there's a marriage of people with the right names for his parents in 1820.

I meant if the marriage is for the same man marrying the mother of his baby then at least the marriage entry shows Richard Payne to be a widower which could explain the long time it took for him to marry Rebecca (ie he waited until his former wife had died).

:D

[lozaras]

Yes, that's what I was saying, lol!

I understand the widower reference now. I didn't realise that illegitimate children could be baptised though.:confused:

[Merry]

I don't believe you!! What about all those threads there have been about how the vicar describes illegitimate children (at baptism)......illegitimate, b*stard, base born, natural child, love child etc etc :)

[lozaras]

OK - I did know :o - obviously it's just my brain that's malfunctioning at ALL times of day & night!!
but didn't think both parents were named...

[Merry]

I think that depends on the date and the vicar. Sometimes they say the father is 'reputed' and other times just give his name with no further comment. After the mid-1800s the number of fathers names given for illegitimate children drops dramatically. Was that when they church was no longer responsible for making sure these father's coughed up some maintenence?

[kiterunner]

I think it might also depend on whether the father acknowledged paternity or not. It looks likely that in this case he did.

[lozaras]

I think that's what threw me, Kate.
It's one thing naming the father but another actually giving the child the father's surname.

[ElizabethHerts]

Sarah, have you seen this census entry?

1841 Census
PAYNE, Rebecca
ST OLAVE UNION, Surrey
HO107 piece 1087 folio 7/56 page 6

[lozaras]

Yes, thanks Elizabeth. It was in my first post ;)