Janet
05-08-11, 02:35
I really would like to know what ever became of my maternal grandfather's only sibling, his sister Maggie.
My greatgrandparents James and Emma Berry (nee Pickles) had two children in Sutton-in-Craven, near Keighley, in the West Riding:
1. my grandfather Walter, b 16 January 1875
http://genealogistsforum.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=10859
2. his sister Maggie (Maggy/Margret?) b 30 December 1878
Maggie was at the wedding in Leeds with her boyfriend Charlie on 26 April 1900 when her brother Walter Berry married Lily Spence, and there is a photo including the two of them.
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-cx9OUnn9e2M/TjtSPRI_b4I/AAAAAAAAAdg/SiyrUW1Za44/s1600/Berry%2Bfamily%2B-%2Bwedding%2B600%2Bdpi.jpg
They are the two at the far left in the wedding photo, him standing and her sitting in front of him. Emma, the mother of Walter and Maggie, is second from right in the back row.
I've just received the certificates for Maggie's birth, Emma's death, and Charlie and Maggie's marriage:
Maggie Berry, b 30 December 1878, father James Berry, Coal Dealer, mother Emma Berry formerly Pickles
Emma Berry, d 13 July 1919, 15 Newton Street, Nelson, 64 years, cancer of liver, wife of James Berry a Coal Dealer, Maggie Berry, Daughter, in attendance
Charles Johnson and Maggie Berry, 7 August 1919, at the RO, Burnley, by licence
Charles 33 years [a mistake or a lie :(], Bachelor, Oil & Tallow Refiner (Master), 15 Newton Street, Nelson, father John Johnson, Farmer
Maggie 39 years, Spinster, Cotton Winder, 15 Newton Street, Nelson, father James Berry, Coal Dealer
Witnesses John Watson and Margaret Shann
I am very frustrated because I was waiting to see Charlie's age on the marriage cert. It says 33 and I don't believe it for one minute. Look at the age of him in the 1900 wedding photo! If he were 33 in 1919 he would have had to be 14 years old in 1900. I can't think why he would be lying about his age, especially making himself 6 years younger than his wife, so I can only think this is a mistake. How frustrating. So I still haven't much clue where he came from, except that he gives his father as John Johnson, a farmer, and farmers don't move far; so I expect the family is right there somewhere nearby, assuming he and Maggie have settled in Charlie's neighborhood. Might Charlie's occupation of Oil & Tallow Refiner even fit in with his father's farm?
After this I lose sight of them. I see there is an entry for 15 Newton Street, Nelson, on the 1911 census. Can anyone with FMP perhaps see if they are there, and if so who else is with them? That could possibly give me some slim lead. Many thanks in advance.
My grandmother's 1934 address book has them as:
Charlie & Maggie Johnson
133 Bewsey Rd.
Warrington, Lanc.
which is then crossed out and replaced with:
Johnson, Chas. & Maggie
Dyson's Fold Farm
311 Wigan Rd., Leigh, Lanc.
Eng.
I don't know where these addresses were obtained or if they were ever valid. After the death of their father James Berry, there are masses of correspondence between my grandfather and the bank responsible for his late father's probate where Walter inquires as to Maggie's whereabouts, saying he has not been able to find her and that if she cannot be found then the entire estate should revert to himself. (The bank politely declined to abide by his logic.)
My grandfather apparently never did find Maggie and Charlie as after his death in the 1950s there is another letter, by my father this time, acting as attorney for my mother and her sister that attempts to draw Maggie out of hiding but seems never to have had any response. He may have been talking to a dead person by that time.
Family lore expresses the fear that Maggie and Charlie were killed in the WWII bombing, and indeed I found some possible deaths at the time of the bombing of Manchester in June 1945:
Johnson Maggie Manchester 8d 186
Johnson Charles H 74 Manchester 8d 48
But there is also a death of a Maggie Johnson in March Qtr 1958 in Leigh, same as my Maggie's last known address:
JOHNSON Maggie Leigh 10d 23
Could have been another Maggie Johnson. A relative of Charlie's? I expect this is probably not my Maggie at all, but who knows?
Skipping back to 1901, I thought perhaps I'd found Maggie in service in 1901 in Keighley as Margret Berry age 22 b1879 Skipton, Yorkshire, relationship to head of household: Servant (familysearch).
But caution: there is another Maggie Berry, Walter's first cousin, living in the same neighborhood.
http://search.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/sse.dll?db=uki1881&indiv=try&h=23724955
She was not born the same year as my Maggie, though. Cousin Maggie should have been 26 in 1901, not 22. So I think this Keighley one could possibly be my Maggie. Would she possibly move from service to cotton winder? And if this is Maggie, then I wonder if we might see Charlie nearby, even in the same house perhaps? But I didn't know how to find him. Maybe someone else can.
I don't know if I'll ever find the answers, but any suggestions gratefully accepted!
My greatgrandparents James and Emma Berry (nee Pickles) had two children in Sutton-in-Craven, near Keighley, in the West Riding:
1. my grandfather Walter, b 16 January 1875
http://genealogistsforum.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=10859
2. his sister Maggie (Maggy/Margret?) b 30 December 1878
Maggie was at the wedding in Leeds with her boyfriend Charlie on 26 April 1900 when her brother Walter Berry married Lily Spence, and there is a photo including the two of them.
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-cx9OUnn9e2M/TjtSPRI_b4I/AAAAAAAAAdg/SiyrUW1Za44/s1600/Berry%2Bfamily%2B-%2Bwedding%2B600%2Bdpi.jpg
They are the two at the far left in the wedding photo, him standing and her sitting in front of him. Emma, the mother of Walter and Maggie, is second from right in the back row.
I've just received the certificates for Maggie's birth, Emma's death, and Charlie and Maggie's marriage:
Maggie Berry, b 30 December 1878, father James Berry, Coal Dealer, mother Emma Berry formerly Pickles
Emma Berry, d 13 July 1919, 15 Newton Street, Nelson, 64 years, cancer of liver, wife of James Berry a Coal Dealer, Maggie Berry, Daughter, in attendance
Charles Johnson and Maggie Berry, 7 August 1919, at the RO, Burnley, by licence
Charles 33 years [a mistake or a lie :(], Bachelor, Oil & Tallow Refiner (Master), 15 Newton Street, Nelson, father John Johnson, Farmer
Maggie 39 years, Spinster, Cotton Winder, 15 Newton Street, Nelson, father James Berry, Coal Dealer
Witnesses John Watson and Margaret Shann
I am very frustrated because I was waiting to see Charlie's age on the marriage cert. It says 33 and I don't believe it for one minute. Look at the age of him in the 1900 wedding photo! If he were 33 in 1919 he would have had to be 14 years old in 1900. I can't think why he would be lying about his age, especially making himself 6 years younger than his wife, so I can only think this is a mistake. How frustrating. So I still haven't much clue where he came from, except that he gives his father as John Johnson, a farmer, and farmers don't move far; so I expect the family is right there somewhere nearby, assuming he and Maggie have settled in Charlie's neighborhood. Might Charlie's occupation of Oil & Tallow Refiner even fit in with his father's farm?
After this I lose sight of them. I see there is an entry for 15 Newton Street, Nelson, on the 1911 census. Can anyone with FMP perhaps see if they are there, and if so who else is with them? That could possibly give me some slim lead. Many thanks in advance.
My grandmother's 1934 address book has them as:
Charlie & Maggie Johnson
133 Bewsey Rd.
Warrington, Lanc.
which is then crossed out and replaced with:
Johnson, Chas. & Maggie
Dyson's Fold Farm
311 Wigan Rd., Leigh, Lanc.
Eng.
I don't know where these addresses were obtained or if they were ever valid. After the death of their father James Berry, there are masses of correspondence between my grandfather and the bank responsible for his late father's probate where Walter inquires as to Maggie's whereabouts, saying he has not been able to find her and that if she cannot be found then the entire estate should revert to himself. (The bank politely declined to abide by his logic.)
My grandfather apparently never did find Maggie and Charlie as after his death in the 1950s there is another letter, by my father this time, acting as attorney for my mother and her sister that attempts to draw Maggie out of hiding but seems never to have had any response. He may have been talking to a dead person by that time.
Family lore expresses the fear that Maggie and Charlie were killed in the WWII bombing, and indeed I found some possible deaths at the time of the bombing of Manchester in June 1945:
Johnson Maggie Manchester 8d 186
Johnson Charles H 74 Manchester 8d 48
But there is also a death of a Maggie Johnson in March Qtr 1958 in Leigh, same as my Maggie's last known address:
JOHNSON Maggie Leigh 10d 23
Could have been another Maggie Johnson. A relative of Charlie's? I expect this is probably not my Maggie at all, but who knows?
Skipping back to 1901, I thought perhaps I'd found Maggie in service in 1901 in Keighley as Margret Berry age 22 b1879 Skipton, Yorkshire, relationship to head of household: Servant (familysearch).
But caution: there is another Maggie Berry, Walter's first cousin, living in the same neighborhood.
http://search.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/sse.dll?db=uki1881&indiv=try&h=23724955
She was not born the same year as my Maggie, though. Cousin Maggie should have been 26 in 1901, not 22. So I think this Keighley one could possibly be my Maggie. Would she possibly move from service to cotton winder? And if this is Maggie, then I wonder if we might see Charlie nearby, even in the same house perhaps? But I didn't know how to find him. Maybe someone else can.
I don't know if I'll ever find the answers, but any suggestions gratefully accepted!