60 year old mother...

[Rachel A]

... with softening of the brain in 1887?? :confused:

Is it feasible that the husband/father of the baby registered her as the mother, even though she was the baby of his housekeeper/lover/later wife, to cover up the scandal? Surely doubt would have been raised to the ability of his wife to have a baby? Or would the registrar just take the husband/father's word for it?? :confused:

[Tom Tom]

Did the lady supposedly die in childbirth then? Or was there a birth registered (by the father) with her as the mother around the time she died?

I would think it could depend on a few things -
The area, would the Registrar have known everyone (ie they worked a rural sub district) and known the man registering the birth / death?
Was he well respected or a land owner - things might get brushed over.

From the sounds of it, he has registered the baby just to make things easier and to ensure he is recognised as the father (rather than having to go as an unmarried couple to the Registrar). Supposedly he then married then housekeeper and she became "Mother" and the child knew nothing more of it?

[Rachel A]

The supposed mother died a few years later, and then the housekeeper (probable mother) married the father. Very cosy!

It was in Brighton and the father was a wine merchant.

[Ann from Sussex]

... with softening of the brain in 1887?? :confused:

Is it feasible that the husband/father of the baby registered her as the mother, even though she was the baby of his housekeeper/lover/later wife, to cover up the scandal? Surely doubt would have been raised to the ability of his wife to have a baby? Or would the registrar just take the husband/father's word for it?? :confused:

Mother's age doesn't come into it when registering a birth does it? It isn't on the certificate so there wouldn't be any need for the registrar to know. He would have taken the father's word for who the mother was, I'm sure. Sounds an interesting thing to uncover Rachel.

[Merry]

Time to but the cert?!!! lol

[Rachel A]

Someone else bought the cert, Merry, in order to unravel the mystery, however the mother's name has been recorded as Hellina and not Emma, which was the 60 year old wife's name, although the maiden name is correct for Emma. The housekeeper (my 3x great aunt) was called Adelaide and she married him after the wife died. Being that the husband was Scots born, I'm wondering if the name error was due to the registrar struggling with his accent!

[Olde Crone]

There are stern warnings in the Register Office about what will happen to you if you knowingly give false information (and are found out....).

Given that, the Registrar's function is to record what he is told. It is not part of his job to sort truth from lies. So, yes, it would be perfectly possible for the father to register the birth in any old name he wanted for the mother.

Incidentally, how do you know the housekeeper was the mother of the child? The wife patently wasn't, but how do you know it was the housekeeper (and not a teenage daughter etc)

OC

[Rachel A]

It just seems the most likely explanation, given Adelaide's 'history'... ;)

Especially as I can't find anyone fitting the Christian name which he gave, with the same maiden name as the wife... :confused:

[BigShaz McCreadie]

Hello... :)
One of mine did similar in that he registered the birth of his son and listed his own mother as the mother of the child.

I came to the conclusion that the registrar asked his questions, Child's name? Your name? Mothers name?
and poor old Adam didn't realise he meant mother of child and not his own mother. hahaha

[Olde Crone]

(Hello Shaz!)

Yes, I have a dimwitted relation who registered her baby with her own father's name...

"Name of child?"
"Name of father?" and she gave her own father's name. Good job I know he had been dead for many years.....

OC

[Ann from Sussex]

Hello... :)
One of mine did similar in that he registered the birth of his son and listed his own mother as the mother of the child.

I came to the conclusion that the registrar asked his questions, Child's name? Your name? Mothers name?
and poor old Adam didn't realise he meant mother of child and not his own mother. hahaha

(Hello Shaz!)

Yes, I have a dimwitted relation who registered her baby with her own father's name...

"Name of child?"
"Name of father?" and she gave her own father's name. Good job I know he had been dead for many years.....

OC


So...if the father in the case Rachel's talking about was asked by the registrar,

"And your wife's name is...?" instead of "And the mother's name is...?", that could explain it.

[Olde Crone]

Ann

Yes, that would explain it. I always think you need to know why a question is being asked before you can answer it correctly.

OC

[BigShaz McCreadie]

Hi OC :)
I hope you are well..?? I think you were about to become a Grandmother last time we spoke....

Hi Ann :)
Yes I guess it could have been the case...

[tenterfieldjulie]

I do have a 60 year old mother in my ancestors. Lots of stories about her including the fact that she couldn't suckle the baby and hired a wet nurse and I think she lived to 105.... I hope it isn't genetic (the age thing I mean)

[Nell]

Hi Shaz

You are behind the times - OC is now grandmother to several infants!!!!

Hope all is well with you.

[Kit]

I do have a 60 year old mother in my ancestors. Lots of stories about her including the fact that she couldn't suckle the baby and hired a wet nurse and I think she lived to 105.... I hope it isn't genetic (the age thing I mean)

I'd rather not be a 60 yo mother.

That sounds awful, I'd rather not be a 60yo mother to a newborn. :rolleyes:

[Olde Crone]

Call me an old cynic, but did the 60yr old mother have an unmarried adult daughter, lol. I do not believe in 60 year old mothers of newborns.

OC

[kiterunner]

Details of TenterfieldJulie's ancestor on this thread, OC (not sure whether you were asking about her or about the original subject of this thread!):
http://genealogistsforum.co.uk/Forum/showthread.php?t=10227

[Olde Crone]

Thanks for the link, Kate, yes, it was Julie's "60 year old mother" I was enquiring about! Sorry, but I still don't believe in 60 year old women giving birth in the 1700s. Either someone's arithmetic is wrong, or there is a naughty daughter in the story.

OC

[Margaret in Burton]

Thanks for the link, Kate, yes, it was Julie's "60 year old mother" I was enquiring about! Sorry, but I still don't believe in 60 year old women giving birth in the 1700s. Either someone's arithmetic is wrong, or there is a naughty daughter in the story.

OC

I agree

[maggie_4_7]

I think it's unlikely that a 60 year old could conceive, at a stretch 55 if you're in your menopause and still having periods but even then it's very unlikely however it is possible and could happen but still unlikely - I don't think a 60 year old woman would still be ovulating naturally.

Unless of course this woman was having a late menopause and then whatever but I'd think some doctor or midwife at the birth might have wrote it up as a miracle.

I think it's a re-adjustment of the biological parents on the paperwork in the presence of an unsuspecting registrar :)

[maggie_4_7]

Ann

Yes, that would explain it. I always think you need to know why a question is being asked before you can answer it correctly.

OC

Oh yes.

Even I have had experience of this in this century and have had to ask sorry can you rephrase that... and then get a blank look.