John Cook - maybe of Manchester - but hopefully from Hampshire

[geniebug]

I'm looking for a John Cook, who, although he married Susannah Lukie (Tottie) Williams, daughter of Joseph Williams, Belalie East, Jamestown (South Australia) was late of Manchester. The marriage was by special licence and recorded in South Australian Register 1839-1900 Friday 12 Sept 1890.

I'm wondering if someone would track down John Cook and Susannah William's families. As I said, she was the daughter of Joseph Williams, and he, John Cook, was the son of the late John Cook of Balaklava, late of Manchester.

Its a long shot, I know. John (Jnr) worked in the railways - he died in West Australia, a few days before 12th January 1912 and although my aunties attended the funeral (they were cousins) - I can't seem to link them up - as the Cooks in my family came from Sheet, Hampshire.

My Hampshire Cook (James) was the son of Daniel Cook, and he did have a brother John born 31 Dec 1843 but was only shown in the 1851 census as a 7yo. Maybe he moved to Manchester and shows place of birth has Hampshire, I don't know? But there is a link somewhere!

[kiterunner]

Do you have an approximate date of birth for the John Cook who married Susannah?

There are a few John Cooks who died in the Crimean War on this site:
http://www.military-genealogy.org.uk

You have to register to view the details - I thought I had an account on there but it seems not. I'm not sure what info it will give you.

[geniebug]

I only know that his father John was born Dec 1843. His brother James born in 1845 had his first child in 1868, so I can only guess John Jnr might have been born around that time.

Ohhhhhh I have stuffed up - John's son was FRANK COOK, and he was 42 when he died in Perth in 1912, therefore born in 1870. My apologies.

Hope that is of some help. Perhaps a census might confirm where Frank & John were born.

[geniebug]

I only know that his father John was born Dec 1843. His brother James born in 1845 had his first child in 1868, so I can only guess John Jnr might have been born around that time.

Ohhhhhh I have stuffed up - John's son was FRANK COOK, and he was 42 when he died in Perth in 1912, therefore born in 1870. My apologies.

Hope that is of some help. Perhaps a census might confirm where Frank & John were born.

Some of the Cooks were born in Sheet, and some in Petersfield, Hampshire.

[ElizabethHerts]

I'm a bit confused now! :o

Could you just confirm who we are looking for, John or Frank?:)

[geniebug]

Sorry Elizabeth - I was trying to confirm that Frank was the son of John Cook )there is a John in my tree) - my mothers cousins attended his (Franks) funeral in West Australia - and his father was John of Manchester. The only John I can find is my ancestor James Cooks brother - they were all from Sheet, or Petersfield Hampshire.

I thought John might have moved away from Hampshire to Manchester - at least that's what I'm trying to find out.

I just want to know how Frank & John are related to my Cooks.

[kiterunner]

So Frank is the one who married Susannah?

[ElizabethHerts]

Do you have Frank's dob and place of birth or just a rough year - i.e. have you found the birth registration?

[kiterunner]

Just realised, if Frank was born in 1870 his father can't have died at Balaclava during the Crimean War! But I see there are some places called Balaclava or Balaklava in Australia, so John Cook probably lived in one of those places?

[geniebug]

The newspaper cuttings might help.

Yes, Balaklava and Belalie East, Jamestown are both in South Australia.

Frank born about 1870, John his father born Dec 1843 ONLY if he is the brother of my James Cook of Sheet/Petersfield Hampshire.

Hope that is clearer now.

[kiterunner]

So, your John Cook is the one who is on the 1851 census at Mill Lane, Sheet, Hampshire, age 8, birthplace Sheet, parents Daniel and Sarah. And if he is Frank's father, he could have emigrated to Australia at any time before 1912 and Frank may have been born in England or Australia? But if the two John Cooks are one and the same person, he has to go to Manchester at some point before he goes to Balaklava. As far as I can see, there isn't a Manchester in Australia, is that right? Also, is it possible to look for a John Cook death in any of the Balaklavas in Australia?

[kiterunner]

There is this on the Trove site:
South Australian Advertiser Wed 16 Feb 1887
IN MEMORIAM
COOK - In loving remembrance of my dear husband, John Cook, of Balaklava, and the dearly beloved father of Mrs William Williams, of Belalie East, who departed this life on the 18th of February 1886, aged 43 years.

So he was the right age to be the John born at Sheet.

[kiterunner]

And from the Advertiser, Adelaide, 19 Jun 1933:
OBITUARY Mr William Williams, of Military Road, Largs Bay, who died at Semaphore on Friday at the age of 83, was born at One Tree Hill...He was married 52 years ago to Miss E A Cook, only daughter of the late Mr and Mrs John Cook, formerly of Manchester, England.

[kiterunner]

The Advertiser, Adelaide 29 Nov 1906
SILVER WEDDING
WILLIAMS - COOK. On the 29th November, 1881, at Clare... William, third son of the late Thomas Williams, Blyth, to Elizabeth Ann, only daughter of the late John Cook, Balaklava. Present address - Belalie East, Jamestown.

[kiterunner]

The Advertiser, Adelaide, 10 Nov 1899
DEATHS
COOK - On the 6th November, at Jamestown, Mrs E A Cook, widow of the late John Cook, Balaklava, and beloved mother of Mrs Wm Williams, Belalie East, Wm Cook, Hawker, and Frank Cook, North Fremantle, WA, aged 55 years.

[kiterunner]

Ancestry has John Cook listed on the death index for 1886 with father's name given as E A Cook, but I think that is a mistake and it's his wife's name.

[kiterunner]

And his wife is listed for 1899 with father's name John Cook, which again should be spouse's name, but at least it confirms that her name was Elizabeth Ann, the same as their daughter.

[geniebug]

Wow so much information!
So, your John Cook is the one who is on the 1851 census at Mill Lane, Sheet, Hampshire, age 8, birthplace Sheet, parents Daniel and Sarah. And if he is Frank's father, he could have emigrated to Australia at any time before 1912 and Frank may have been born in England or Australia? But if the two John Cooks are one and the same person, he has to go to Manchester at some point before he goes to Balaklava. As far as I can see, there isn't a Manchester in Australia, is that right? Also, is it possible to look for a John Cook death in any of the Balaklavas in Australia?
Re: 1851 Census, I only had him as 7, Sheet Hampshire, but the 1861 Census shows the dwelling as Mill Lane - and yes, John's parents are Daniel & Sarah.
I couldnt see a Manchester in Australia. There were other Cooks in South Australia from this family.
There is this on the Trove site:
South Australian Advertiser Wed 16 Feb 1887
IN MEMORIAM
COOK - In loving remembrance of my dear husband, John Cook, of Balaklava, and the dearly beloved father of Mrs William Williams, of Belalie East, who departed this life on the 18th of February 1886, aged 43 years.

So he was the right age to be the John born at Sheet.
Yes,
And from the Advertiser, Adelaide, 19 Jun 1933:
OBITUARY Mr William Williams, of Military Road, Largs Bay, who died at Semaphore on Friday at the age of 83, was born at One Tree Hill...He was married 52 years ago to Miss E A Cook, only daughter of the late Mr and Mrs John Cook, formerly of Manchester, England. Miss Elsie Cook attended the funeral - no mention of her sister Fay who must have died prior.
And from the Advertiser, Adelaide, 19 Jun 1933:
OBITUARY Mr William Williams, of Military Road, Largs Bay, who died at Semaphore on Friday at the age of 83, was born at One Tree Hill...He was married 52 years ago to Miss E A Cook, only daughter of the late Mr and Mrs John Cook, formerly of Manchester, England.
This proves it was Manchester in England.
The Advertiser, Adelaide 29 Nov 1906
SILVER WEDDING
WILLIAMS - COOK. On the 29th November, 1881, at Clare... William, third son of the late Thomas Williams, Blyth, to Elizabeth Ann, only daughter of the late John Cook, Balaklava. Present address - Belalie East, Jamestown.
I wondered where the William Williams came from!
The Advertiser, Adelaide, 10 Nov 1899
DEATHS
COOK - On the 6th November, at Jamestown, Mrs E A Cook, widow of the late John Cook, Balaklava, and beloved mother of Mrs Wm Williams, Belalie East, Wm Cook, Hawker, and Frank Cook, North Fremantle, WA, aged 55 years.
Just about got the whole family now!

Ancestry has John Cook listed on the death index for 1886 with father's name given as E A Cook, but I think that is a mistake and it's his wife's name.
All I have to do now is find out how John got from Hampshire to Manchester to Australia.
There is more - I don't know if you read the funeral notice right through - now that we know who everyone else is.

Frank Cook was the great grandson of the late Earl of Talbot and Susannah was the granddaughter of Captain G.H. Murray.

Thank you for the very valuable information. :)

[kiterunner]

Aha, this family in 1871 looks promising! Apart from being nowhere near Manchester, lol.

High St., Swanage, Dorset
John Cook Head Mar 28 Bricklayer Hants Petersfield
Elizabeth A Do Wife Mar 26 Dorset Langton
Elizabeth A Do Daur 6 Scholar Do Do
John J Cook Son 4 Do Sussex Brighton
William Cook Son 2 Dorset Swanage
Frank Do Son 2 mo Do Do

Though I have to say, it seems unlikely that one of them is the great-grandchild of the Earl of Talbot? Have you come across such a connection before?

[ElizabethHerts]

So this should be the birth

Civil Registration event: Birth
Name: COOK, Frank
Registration District: Wareham
County: Dorset
Year of Registration: 1871
Quarter of Registration: Jan-Feb-Mar
Mother's Maiden Name: Not available before 1911 Q3
Volume No: 5A
Page No: 317

[geniebug]

Though I have to say, it seems unlikely that one of them is the great-grandchild of the Earl of Talbot? Have you come across such a connection before?No I haven't Kite (giggling) -

My James Cook was told to be related to THE James Cook - by our ancestors - a lot of hogwash! lol

But that census 1871 sounds veryyyy promising!

[geniebug]

Thanks Elizabeth and Kite, of course !! :) This will keep me going for ages. I really do appreciate you finding the missing link!!

[kiterunner]

I just remembered ancestry has Dorset PR's!

Baptism 25 Sep 1864 at Langton Matravers - Elizabeth Ann, daughter of John and Elizabeth Cook, New ??? Buildings, bricklayer.

So Elizabeth sr may not be an Elizabeth Ann on the marriage.

[geniebug]

Wow - thank you again!

[tenterfieldjulie]

Now Jood, ..... you cannot drink a whole bottle of champers on your own ..... wait until I get my glass ......... we can toast all those wonderful upovers at GF .... Now Jood, do not get on the table ............... you might fall ..... oh dear ...... Jood .... where are you ...... oh yes under the table snoring .... lol James Cook .... Earl of Talbot .... she'll need an appointment to speak to her on Anzacs ...

[geniebug]

Nah Julie - I don't believe it any more than I believe we are related to James Cook.

I just think sometimes rellies get a bit above themselves!!!!! Its probably someone's wife's father's auntie's neighbour round the corner!

But I probably was snoring (somewhere) lol

[tenterfieldjulie]

How's the head lol

[geniebug]

Not the head, I dinny have a drink, but I have a bellyful of chocolate licorice bullets, and I feel sick ! lol

[tenterfieldjulie]

Red wine would be far more healty!!

[geniebug]

Red wine doesn't like me - I like white wine!!!

[tenterfieldjulie]

I'll have a drink for you then lol

[geniebug]

Just had a tall glass of cream sherry and promptly fell asleep watching tv, - the laptop fell on the floor twice hahahaha

[joolz]

I hope i don't mess this up, and am not sure if i have done this before re John Cook....anyway here i go!
I am the gggranddaughter of John Cook who came to Australia in 1881 on the Star of India also known as the Euterpe.
I am on Frank's direct line.
Is this of any help?
I apologise if i have repeated myself but it has been a long time since i scribed on this page. Julie

[geniebug]

Hi Joolz (Julie) - I don't know if my John Cook came to Australia - I'll have to look up the chart. I know there is a John Cook there, but I thought he was further back in time. Will let you know Joolz (am on the wrong computer at the moment)